Litchi crashed my p4

[Peio64270]

just came across this post and after flicking through all the non post subject junk get to the end.
This is how i see it, the litchi app cant be blamed until everything is seen, we have not seen the mission layout data of the waypoint height settings as it might have just been doing what it was told to do, for one the phantom would not go that high unless the pilot had set that height in the max height settings or it would just use the height setting that the go app set last.
seems to me that the op went into pannic and did all the wrong things going from one to the next and yes I think the motors were shut off by the pilot while still in a tizzy.
(...)

How do you explain the numerous incoherent data in the report of :
Phantom Log Viewer - PhantomHelp.com
...concerning this deadly flight ?

Example :

4m 44s Auto Landing 16satellites 1,376.0ft 7.7mph 28.4ft
4m 44.1s Auto Landing 18satellites 1,378.0ft 8.7mph 33.4ft
4m 44.2s Auto Landing 18satellites 1,379.0ft 9.0mph 34.9ft
4m 44.3s Auto Landing 19satellites 1,380.0ft 8.6mph 37.5ft
4m 44.5s Auto Landing 19satellites 1,380.0ft 8.1mph 41.8ft
(...)
4m 59.2s Auto Landing 19satellites 1,465.0ft 0.9mph 80.5ft
4m 59.6s Auto Landing 19satellites 1,467.0ft 0.9mph 81.0ft
(...)
5m 7.8s Auto Landing 19satellites 1,513.0ft 0.9mph 95.8ft

During 34sec the drone is set in "auto-landing" and its altitude apparently **increases** from 1376ft to 1513ft (about 140ft is significant). The same about the speed of some mph which apparently doesn't move the craft in an other part of the filght record while it is set in "RTH".

 

[Mad_angler1]

@chris digata Are you saying DJI wont entertain a claim whilst using 3rd party app, because if you are you are very wrong.

Read DJI T&C

 

[sar104]

I think that it was not the app. I could have been the votex affect. The prop wash as it is descending will cause turbulence and will flip it over. It is better to glide it in for a safe landing.

If you had experienced VRS with one of these quads I think you would know that it does not cause the aircraft to flip and descend inverted. VRS typically leads to a relatively stable but rapid and uncontrolled descent. In this case the motors seem to have stopped completely, and the flight data indicate multiple issues before the descent that are clearly unrelated to VRS. Additionally, the P4 seems to be mostly immune from VRS - I've seen no reports at all with that aircraft, unlike the early P2s which would drop like a brick with little provocation.

 

[Jim Williams]

Wow I have been wondering how trustworthy a third party app is for control...sounds like it is still not ready for primetime.

I wouldn't jump to a conclusion that it was Litchi...could have been some problem with the drone itself, hopefully the logs will reveal something.

 

[Sim597]

All these ppl saying "it couldn't be this and couldn't be that" and "I've used it bla bla bla times and nothing"
Something went wrong, I agree it doesn't point to Litchi, but unfortunately without this crash in the DJIGO app only, this had to be included.
Everyone, like the guy who's P4 flew into the clock, who says it "has to be pilot error" knows little or nothing about machines, they fail, the more complex they are, the harder it CAN be to pinpoint.
There are a couple facts that can't be diminished, the logs show there was a computer software or hardware malfunction. Anyone using the logs as proof of anything after sporadic errors cannot be used as hard data, it's known to be corrupted at that point, just because one sensor says one thing, the computer failure cannot be ruled out as the culprit.
The other fact is, maybe there is always something else a pilot can do, I'm a pretty dang good pilot, and at the crucible of failure, I may not do things 100% correctly either in a flat out panic, and seeing your bird upside down, would panic just about any pilot.
Finally I think without question DJI should replace this AC.
In my honesty I can say I usually feel this way if the logs show ANY corruption or error. In defense I will say that I cannot stand those who crash themselves and try to use DJI to replace their screw up


Sent from my iPhone using PhantomPilots mobile app

 

[Ibmftw]

Read DJI T&C

I have quiet a few times the last time was when I had to get a complete P3A replacement for a catastrohpic hardware failure whilst I was flying with 3rd party app, which section of the terms and conditions are you reffering to? Perhaps the rules have changed

 

[chris digata]

@chris digata Are you saying DJI wont entertain a claim whilst using 3rd party app, because if you are you are very wrong.

NO they wont if a command came from the app, what im saying is they will not look at the app data once they see no fault in the hardware
they state using 3rd party apps is at the owners risk

 

[Jayfdee]

Sorry you lost your P4,yes it crashed, but the Jury is out on the cause, Litchi, maybe, case not proven.
I use Litchi without problem,but I would be very interested to know the cause.

 

[Sim597]

I have quiet a few times the last time was when I had to get a complete P3A replacement for a catastrohpic hardware failure whilst I was flying with 3rd party app, which section of the terms and conditions are you reffering to? Perhaps the rules have changed

Did they make you whole? Or did they tell you to pound sand? I'd love to hear they made it right.

 

[Jussaguy]

uhh, why prompted you to use this app (never heard of it)?

Litchi is the most powerful and certainly most popular waypoint mission app for DJI products.

It might be the most popular 3rd party app for DJI and most used next to the Go App.

 

[JerEl]

Today was the last day, at least for a while, that i flew my p4. Just a month old and now already dead How? I did some new test out today with the litchi app on a new spot to fly some waypoints. 9 waypoints total. All waypoints were set on 10m altitude and tripple checked all setting. Length of the flight 715m and the duration of the flight 3 min. It went fine to the first waypoint. But on the way to the second waypoint is went up in the air like crazy till around 400m high. No way to stop it. The pause button didn't work while it was going up so pressed the return to home button. then it came down slowly. Then the horror happened. It just flipped ver and crashed down on the ground. Housing cracked open, gimbal bended and damaged, props gone and some more damage.. any idea why this happened and what went wrong? I have the flight logs and video if that would make things more clear..
thanks guys!

Here the screenshot from after the crash. -411m? Im forever done with this app. It just dont do what it supposed to do.. [file]litchi crash p4|none[/file]

Here are the flight logs..
HealthyDrones.com - Innovative flight data analysis that matters

and here is the video..

I'be been flying almost exclusively with Litchi, manual flying and using the features in Litchi, for about 8 months and have never had a problem with Litchi itself. I prefer it over the GO app and only use the GO app for updates, a few camera settings not included in Litchi, and then test flights after upgrading. So I doubt the problem is with Litchi as very few have had any unusual behavior with Litchi. Most of the problems are tablet/phone problems crashing the app including the GO app. It pays to double check right before taking off each waypoint individually to make sure the altitude and camera angle is correct. Sounds like you had some problem with the P4 other than Litchi.

 

[JerEl]

Nobody here seem to have payed attention to this warning begining at 3min 18" : "IOC error : failed" (and repeated at 3min 21.6").
What can it be in a Phantom4 ?

In the video, there is also strange movements at .3min 11". Due to the gimbal ?

I agree that at 3min 54" on the video the drone behaves just like if the motors suddenly stoped. But nothing in the logs which, in turn, continue to indicate 1291 ft at this moment while the AC is obviously much lower.

IOC error can mean a few different things most having to do with computers but who knows what DJI uses the error message for.

Could be: Input/Output Controller, Inversion Of Control, Infrastructure Operating Center, Input Output Controller,
Input/Output Configuration (Computer-Hardware Error), and Indicator of Compromise(Computing-Security),

For another poster:
The Ring Vortex State (RVS) problem was corrected from days of P2 and continues. All they did on the P2 was make the maximum descend rate slower. They may have done software fixes on the P3 and P4 like not allowing the motors to race to up if in fact it senses some RVS happening. Because if it dropping faster than the it should the motors would speed up to stop the rapid descent but doing that makes the RVS worse. If you see your copter wobbling while descending that is an indication of the beginning of RVS so it is best if you want to descend fast to do it in a spiral motion so that you fly away from any vortices. Especially in gusty conditions where the wind may stop and start. It's possible the sensors can't sense and send correcting data fast enough to correct the problem.

You may have noticed that some quadcopters have the props slanted slightly inward. That negates any RVS happening. as it throws the propwash out to the sides.

 

[Sim597]

I've seen mine wobble terribly the other day, was coming in at an angle with mostly down stick, it was only for a second but bad enough for me to comment about it and make a note, it was windy and in a turbulent area off the houses roofline


Sent from my iPhone using PhantomPilots mobile app

 

[cokeaddict]

I assure you from experience, using a 3rd party app is a perfect excuse to void any claim. DJi are very good at that. How can anyone prove it was the app that caused it? Knowing Dji history of birds falling out of the sky goes back years. I had one too and they claimed it was pilot error (p2 with gopro).

 

[Ibmftw]

Okay for some people in this thread try this approach, once you have done adequate research and know how to, or have had someone who knows how to, decipher your logs and are certain its a HW/FW error, send an email to DJI support asking them which part of the logs indicate a software error because you wish to take legal action against the 3rd party app vendor and when you spoke to someone on the technical team of your 3rd party vendor, you was made aware they used DJI's SDK programmed for their flight controller and that they were very certain it was a DJI problem and they asked you to show them which part of the logs indicate a front side software application problem, they also told you not to worry about your broken Phantom too much because consumers of faulty goods are protected under the "Consumers Rights Act 2015". When you explain this to DJI do not do it rudely, act has though you are on their side and feel as though the 3rd party vendor is trying to scam you and that you want to take legal action against them, now most of the time using this approach your case will get elevated and someone a bit higher up the food chain, level 1 or even relations will get back to you if you word it well. Shouting at DJI like a street yob telling them your gonna sue them will get you waiting in a 2 hour queue or laughed off the phone.

 

[Jussaguy]

Okay for some people in this thread try this approach, once you have done adequate research and know how to, or have had someone who knows how to, decipher your logs and are certain its a HW/FW error, send an email to DJI support asking them which part of the log indicate a software error because you wish to take legal action action against the 3rd party vendor and when you spoke to someone on the technical team of your 3rd party vendor, you was made aware they used DJI's SDK programmed for their flight controller and that they were very certain it was a DJI problem and they asked you to show them which part of the logs indicate a front side software application problem, they also told you not to worry about your broken Phantom too much because consumers of faulty goods are protected under the "Consumers Rights Act 2015". When you explain this to DJI do not do it rudely, act has though you are on their side and feel as though the 3rd party vendor is trying to scam you and that you want to take legal action against them, now most of the time using this approach your case will get elevated and someone a bit higher up the food chain, level 1 or even relations will get back to you if you word it well. Shouting at DJI like a street yob telling them your gonna sue them will get you waiting in a 2 hour queue or laughed or the phone.

Bam!

Just a great post!

 

[Toyz]

The consumer rights act could help if both the buyer and seller are located in the UK.

 

[Tenly]

Litchi is the most powerful and certainly most popular waypoint mission app for DJI products.

It might be the most popular 3rd party app for DJI and most used next to the Go App.

ROFLMAO!!!!

Most powerful? Not a chance!

Autopilot's waypoint mode is far more powerful than Litchi's. I don't say that to take anything away from Litchi. Litchi is a very good product - and you may be right that it's the most popular - but I doubt you have citations for any of those claims. Part of the reason Litchi could be the most popular/most used is that it's available for Android AND iOS whereas Autopilot is (currently) only available for iOS. Litchi is also more intuitive and easier for new users to get started whereas Autopilot, providing more features and more granular control, understandably is a bit more complex to control - at least in the beginning.

But more importantly - both of these 3rd-party apps license and use an SDK provided by DJI specifically to make the creation of these 3rd party apps possible. All of their communication with the Phantom is handled through DJI-written API's - therefore - simply using a third-party app DEFINITELY does NOT void your warranty.

If the program logic contained within Litchi or Autopilot causes a crash - you may have to look to them for reimbursement and they may or may not help you...but if there were a programming error in the DJI SDK that the 3rd party apps are built on, then DJI will be responsible. If a sensor malfunctions or any other kind of hardware problem occurs - that's also something DJI will be responsible for - no matter what program you happened to be running to control the bird.

Litchi, Autopilot and some of the other apps are so full featured, you might be able to use them exclusively and only use DJI Go very occasionally - to link a new RC or to put the AC in flight data mode - and that's awesome and convenient - but these apps are not in competition with DJI Go - they are built to be supplements to Go. And DJI does not actively discourage the use of these 3rd party apps. They encourage it. They provide support and developmental assistance to the 3rd party app development teams. These 3rd party apps bring new capabilities to the Phantoms which helps to further differentiate them (DJI) from their competitors.

If you own a Phantom - you're not being smart by avoiding the 3rd party apps. You're doing yourself a disservice. Check out what's possible with Litchi. Look what you can do with Autopilot! Read their FAQ's regarding your warranty. Don't take the word of a fear-monger on a forum to be factual. Spend some time in YouTube looking through the tutorials and give one - or both of them a try! I currently have AutoPilot, Litchi and FPV Camera - and I use them all - but I like Autopilot the best - especially for waypoints - because it has options the others don't. And those options let me get the exact shots I want - whereas with Litchi or FPV Camera - I'd be forced to compromise and make trade offs.

My condolences to the OP. I think there's enough evidence in the logs to prove there were errors with hardware or software under DJI control and that they should replace this Aircraft free of charge.

Good Luck!

 

[Zuzua]

One very big difference between litchi waypoints and auto pilot waypoints: in AP, you can control the speed at every waypoint, ie: different approach speed and once at the waypoint you can set a different speed. This simple task can not be done in litchi YET. Btw, I only have litchi and love it but AP is a more powerful app, unfortunately I don't have enough patience to learn AP app, litchi was very easy learning curve.

 

[Ibmftw]

Autopilot is not "more powerful than" it is "different to" Litchi, tell me, if I want to fly autonomous missions outside of radio range is AP still more powerful than Litchi or does AP become useless in comparison? Different horses for different courses, I say take advantage of all these well established 3rd party and enjoy the technology that entails.