City Park Ranger's Enforcement

[PayDayPirate]

Hey PayDay -
I've been flying in Maple Leaf park, Discovery Park and Gasworks in Seattle. Haven't seen any enforcement folks ever and people have been very interested in the camera/quad system. Pretty laid back response despite the news - mostly "hey that's cool".

The FAA "rules" are actually guidance not law - just FYI - I've seen the original (scanned) document and it is clearly guidance. Still wise to follow the guidance but until there are real laws on the books, being responsible and safe is going to have to be our best guide. For example - I was at Gasworks, flying over land at 250 feet, then noted some seaplanes coming in to land on Lake Union. I decided to stay at 100 ft max and well out of the way of their flight path. Since it's not a designated airport, the Phantom didn't go into failsafe mode. I'm not going to fly there again, since it feels like the airspace really isn't clear. Just an example of being on the safe side even though there are rules against it.

I've been wanting to fly at Gasworks but I think I would stay well below 250ft. I could certainly see the seaplanes being a concern. That and everyone flying their kites. Maybe not the best spot. Have you by chance also been at Greenlake? I know I've seen a quad copter pilot there recently as well.

 

[slothead]

Seaplanes/floatplanes! That raises a good question. Since on land, runways identify most of the airport keep out zones (there are some well-to-do farmers that like to use their fields for small plane flights but they are in a minority), the seaplanes/floatplanes can land on almost any waterway/lake/harbor. That opens up the potential for interfering with flight big-time! How is one to determine safe flight zones over water? Is there some FAA limitation for water-borne plane zones that can be found somewhere online? Or do we just have to play that by ear?

 

[CarlJ]

This is not the place for para-legal advice or information.

I can't believe you'd consider arguing with a public safety officer regardless of your [possible] knowledge to the contrary.

You sort out the who's right / wrong later for the next time.

Wow ok. I thought it would have been the BEST place. I mean it's a place where people can hear others' experiences right?

I mean all I've heard is that enforcement is a gray area. You stay below 400ft and you're not in a restricted area then you're not breaking the law right? Maybe I'm wrong. That's just what I've heard.

I'm not one to argue with an officer but maybe others here have. Just curious.

I agree, this is a really bad place for legal advice. At this point I think it's best to avoid the mere appearance of impropriety given the horrendous reputation that our hobby has acquired of late. Enforcement isn't a gray area, and that's why this forum is such a bad place for legal advice...

 

[IrishSights]

So far on this thread I can't see any 'legal advice' given. Shared thoughts on legal issues, yes but that is what forums are for. In the end no one is going to base anything of any substance on a forum opinon lol. A bit like believing everything you read in newspapers! I would encourage opinions and that is exactly what they are. Why not discuss it

 

[N017RW]

Perhaps the contex has been lost.

The thread's OP had the following question in it:
(emphasis in bold added)

"I guess my question is, can they legally ask me to leave and/or stop flying because it's disturbing the peace or say they just don't allow it?

Thus my assertion that this is not a place for such advice.

 

[Cocoa Beach Kiter]

I do a lot of kiteboarding (hence my user name) and there are a lot of areas that have banned the sport or put restrictions on where and how you do it. If I travel to an area I am unfamiliar with, I find it helpful to contact the local kite boarding shop and ask them what the rules are for their local area. I would suggest that this might also help those of us flying our quads in a new area and want to know how the locals feel about our sport and what local rules are.

At least that might keep us from going to areas where it is known to cause an issue. However I would agree with the response that if asked to leave I would politely land, offer an apology, and leave.

 

[MapMaker53]

I think that is an excellent idea to contact a local model aircraft flying club and inquire about local regulations.

 

[Jstic]

This is not the place for para-legal advice or information.

I can't believe you'd consider arguing with a public safety officer regardless of your [possible] knowledge to the contrary.

You sort out the who's right / wrong later for the next time.

Wow ok. I thought it would have been the BEST place. I mean it's a place where people can hear others' experiences right?

I mean all I've heard is that enforcement is a gray area. You stay below 400ft and you're not in a restricted area then you're not breaking the law right? Maybe I'm wrong. That's just what I've heard.

I'm not one to argue with an officer but maybe others here have. Just curious.

I agree, this is a really bad place for legal advice. At this point I think it's best to avoid the mere appearance of impropriety given the horrendous reputation that our hobby has acquired of late. Enforcement isn't a gray area, and that's why this forum is such a bad place for legal advice...

This is not someone coming on a forum asking for advice on how to defend a murder rap for pete's sake.

Maybe some of us have had an experience with a park or enforcement officer and have been advised of the law and can pass it on to the OP. This is a VERY GOOD place to get information on the OP's question. Like anything in life, you have to use common sense when someone tells you something. At the end of the day OP got a lot of GOOD advice and suggestions as to how to handle the situation,and that is what is important. If you and N007W want to be a forum moderators, go for it. Until then, cut the OP some slack.

 

[IrishSights]

Perhaps the contex has been lost.

The thread's OP had the following question in it:
(emphasis in bold added)

"I guess my question is, can they legally ask me to leave and/or stop flying because it's disturbing the peace or say they just don't allow it?

Thus my assertion that this is not a place for such advice.

I agree that was the question but it was not in the answers given. Its quite usual for a question to be asked and the answers are not directly what the OPer asked, but the subject nevertheless gets addressed. As is the case here. Also no one asks or expects a forum to give legal advice in the true sense of the term, thats what lawyers are for, we all no that, its our opinions he was asking for and thats what he got

 

[CarlJ]

Oh now you agree the OP was asking about legality...

I don't take people that talk in circles seriously, so there's not much point in a continued response.

 

[IrishSights]

Oh now you agree the OP was asking about legality...

I don't take people that talk in circles seriously, so there's not much point in a continued response.

You obviously didn't read and understand my post if its me your actually commenting on as you quoted no one.

Sent from Samsung S4 via Tapatalk

 

[CRankin]

I do a lot of kiteboarding (hence my user name) and there are a lot of areas that have banned the sport or put restrictions on where and how you do it. If I travel to an area I am unfamiliar with, I find it helpful to contact the local kite boarding shop and ask them what the rules are for their local area. I would suggest that this might also help those of us flying our quads in a new area and want to know how the locals feel about our sport and what local rules are.

With all due respect (and I certainly mean no disrespect here), I don't really think that how the locals feel about flying drones around really matters much. It doesn't really matter how people feel about us flying around taking pictures and video, as long as we aren't breaking any laws in the process. After all, we have as much right to take photos of interesting and cool places as the next person; the only difference is that we're doing it from a bit of a different perspective. People - whether law enforcement or ordinary citizens - shouldn't be able to discriminate against us simply because we choose to use a different tool to express ourselves.

 

[ircphoenix]

Having nearly 8 years of law enforcement experience, I can tell you that Werz's advice will serve you well in any and all contacts with any sort of law enforcement agent.

And to respectfully disagree with CRankin, the local feelings do matter... Because the locals are the ones that petition their council people to ban things that the locals don't like. If you walk in to an area with a "screw those people. I'm perfectly legal" attitude, then you very well may ruin that area for the next RC person that wants to fly there.

 

[Gr8Chef]

Wait until they get a load of this!

http://news.yahoo.com/video/hoverbike-a ... 18218.html

I'm sure people were freaking out when cars first began disturbing horses back in the day. And especially when airplanes and jets started flying through the sky.

I noticed this weekend while flying near a park and subdivision the NOISE level of weedeaters and lawn mowers and loud pipe Harley's in the area. And my "toy" copter at 400 feet is ruining people's day?