Beta Testers requested to fix Compass Issue

[BigBadFun]

I don't think that 3.05 fixes the problem, or possibly even tackles the fundamental issue....

It does. It cures the TBE 100% and also dramatically reduces the J-hooking. I've flown my P2 alongside a beta tester in my city. Mine is totally unstable in GPS mode. His is a joy to fly and would solve all my problems and many others. Stop patronising us.

 

[robby666111]

Stop patronising us.

Well said.

 

[sar104]

I don't think that 3.05 fixes the problem, or possibly even tackles the fundamental issue....

It does. It cures the TBE 100% and also dramatically reduces the J-hooking. I've flown my P2 alongside a beta tester in my city. Mine is totally unstable in GPS mode. His is a joy to fly and would solve all my problems and many others. Stop patronising us.

OK - let me be more specific: it has not cured the hook effect for me, and it appears to try to work simply by learning faster, rather than by correctly offsetting the compass reading by the declination, which is what I would characterize as the fundamental issue. The declination at your location is substantially higher than here, and so it's quite possible that it makes a noticeable improvement from a worse staring point, but that doesn't mean it is fixed. As anyone who has used one of the rotatable Naza pucks knows - this should be a complete non-issue with either a hardware or a software correction.

And to be clear, I'm not taking a position on whether DJI should release it as is, I was simply pointing out that asserting that they don't care is not consistent with the very existence of this discussion topic. Feel free to continue complaining, but I'm done arguing about this.

 

[Pazz]

I think if that were the case then they wouldn't be writing and testing firmware fixes.

..said he who is probably one of the beta testers.

It really is a case of the have's and have not's within this topic. Those who are beta testers are nice a patient and don't want to rock the boat, while those who aren't keep getting more and more frustrated.

Personally I am happy to wait for the release, as the issue doesn't stop me flying or reduce the enjoyment. I would like to get straighter video, so it will be nice to get the fix, this side of Christmas.

Cheers,
Rob.

OK - so your opinion is that they are writing and testing firmware fixes, but that they don't care at all (to paraphrase the original accusation). Are not that observation and assertion somewhat contradictory? And yes - I am one of the 3.05 beta testers, but I don't think that 3.05 fixes the problem, or possibly even tackles the fundamental issue, so I am also impatient for them to fix this.

What is your experience with 3.05? how does it fly differently? if at all.

 

[Pazz]

Alternatively you can use the waypoint system (just released for iphone) to programme runs using GPS locations. Requires pre planning of your shots, but works well.

Only problem here is the the Phantom "crabs" on an angle when flying waypoints mode, so recorded video is well off centre, even though the path was followed correctly.

True, as a videographer I use that as shot improver, start off right & traverse the shot across to the left, more interesting than boring down the line.

 

[ianwood]

If you feel you are being patronized, you may need to read some more. Just because you saw something that looked like it worked doesn't mean it is a production ready solution.

There will always be complainers who feel entitled to ridicule this effort despite not bothering to understand it properly. I am grateful everyone else has been supportive. And I am even more grateful for the significant contribution of a number of people who haven't complained once.

So let the complainers complain. We're in the home stretch. Even those that did nothing but criticize will have the solution soon. Fingers crossed that could be this weekend or soon after.

 

[xgeek]

Were any beta testers selected in non affected areas to confirm no adverse affects were introduced in the "fix"?

 

[Pazz]

Were any beta testers selected in non affected areas to confirm no adverse affects were introduced in the "fix"?

Good question, perhaps Ian could outline how Beta testers were selected, what areas they came from & explain the science behind what this fix does (actual programming, thats if DJI have actually told you)

 

[ianwood]

Good question, perhaps Ian could outline how Beta testers were selected, what areas they came from & explain the science behind what this fix does (actual programming, thats if DJI have actually told you)

The beta tester selection process has been discussed already. You'll have to go back and read up to find it. One aspect of it is that DJI's main office is in an area of almost no declination.

 

[d4ddyo]

Good question, perhaps Ian could outline how Beta testers were selected, what areas they came from & explain the science behind what this fix does (actual programming, thats if DJI have actually told you)

The beta tester selection process has been discussed already. You'll have to go back and read up to find it. One aspect of it is that DJI's main office is in an area of almost no declination.

Think about our progress... months later 60+ pages of forum replies and we are still getting new reports of this Compass declination issue!

 

[sar104]

What is your experience with 3.05? how does it fly differently? if at all.

What an excellent idea. It's a shame that there isn't a discussion topic somewhere on this website where we could all post our experiences, videos and results from the beta testing. /s

 

[landonkk]

The efforts of everyone involved, especially Ianwood, are greatly appreciated. He organized a well thought out case study of the problem, including his personal diagnosis, and established a quorum of users needed to approach, and subsequently get a response from, DJI.

The fact that a beta was released was a positive step and there is nothing wrong with the way that process is being handled. A beta should not be leaked without the consent of DJI as that puts the project, as well as the beta testers, at risk.

There is a fundamental flaw in the project however that has been detrimental to the efficiency of getting its intended results. I am sure that we can all agree at this point (16 weeks since Ianwoods original post, 14 weeks since DJI's initial response and 10 weeks since the release of the Beta) that this issue is anywhere close to a priority for DJI. Easing any pressure on DJI until there is a public firmware release that fixes the problem only makes it easier for them to move this issue further down their list of priorities.

The quickest reaction we saw from DJI was after Project Drunken Sparrow began attacking DJI support forums, their FB page and Twitter account. It was less than a week after the Project began that they responded with a beta release. At that point it was decided to stop the pressure and since then we have seen nothing but a promise to issue a second beta - that of which is a month old promise.

I implore all of those involved, specifically Ianwood, to begin exerting pressure again and only stop doing so until there is a fix of the problem for all of us.

Arguments against doing so are futile. Thinking that DJI is going to get upset and give up working on a fix because we upset them would necessitate us believing that the engineers in charge are 13 year old girls.

In every other scenario but that one it will do nothing but help our cause.

 

[Andy T]

Arguments against doing so are futile. Thinking that DJI is going to get upset and give up working on a fix because we upset them would necessitate us believing that the engineers in charge are 13 year old girls.

In every other scenario but that one it will do nothing but help our cause.

I agree with you. I have been bugging them on Facebook and YouTube and it has been pretty lonely out there.

 

[AnselA]

The efforts of everyone involved
...
clip...
...
In every other scenario but that one it will do nothing but help our cause.

+1

 

[ianwood]

Landon, none of us can judge how long it should take. Unless you have the source code, you just don't know. I agree it's probably not their top priority but to demand it be put above everything else is unrealistic. In all my discussions with them, I have tried to be reasonable. Why? Because I know they can walk away from the table at any time. And if they do, we have no recourse.

And don't assume the last sparrow effort was that effective. We barely got started and they immediately reached out with an elaborate plan to approach the issue. I think they were going to do so anyway. They were too ready, too fast. I think they were motivated to fix it simply based on the number of people who had reported the problem on this forum. I also sent them frequent updates on the numbers.

Anyway, they asked for another week. It seemed reasonable. Pissing them off with one week to go seems stupid. If it's not done at the end of the weekend, we put the sparrow back to work and see how effective it is. If we do put the sparrow to work, everyone will need to be involved. It will take effort. The impact will need to be sharp and powerful. Way way bigger than before. I hope it's not necessary.

 

[landonkk]

Anyway, they asked for another week. It seemed reasonable. Pissing them off with one week to go seems stupid. If it's not done at the end of the weekend, we put the sparrow back to work and see how effective it is. If we do put the sparrow to work, everyone will need to be involved. It will take effort. The impact will need to be sharp and powerful. Way way bigger than before. I hope it's not necessary.

Again, I fail to see the logic behind the idea that we will piss them off and they will stop work on it out of spite. That completely contradicts your first point that our initial short strike had little influence on them to act (or not) in the first place. I agree with you on that point - they were absolutely working on it beforehand because they understood it was an issue. Why then, all things considered, would they not get mad then and release the beta despite our actions, but now they would somehow slow their efforts if pressure was applied a second time?

They started working on it and will continue to work on it because they know it severely hinders an otherwise outstanding product. A resurgence of gripes and comments will remind them, and more importantly other potential customers, that a TON of people are still having this issue. At the end of the day there is one thing that truly gets things moving... a negative impact on sales, or the likelihood of such.

I am not saying that they are lying to you, but this is the third week in a row that this second beta was 'coming by the end of the week'. At this point last week, in this seemingly never-ending cycle, you agreed we should start up again if they didn't get it done, which they did not... and then they said 'but wait, we are close.' If we simply agreed to just put pressure on them until we got a fix we wouldn't even need to have these arguments. It would be straight forward for everyone involved. I honestly think the longer this goes, the less effective we will be. People who were eager to help initially have given up because the perception is that nothing is happening.

 

[d4ddyo]

Landon, none of us can judge how long it should take. Unless you have the source code, you just don't know. I agree it's probably not their top priority but to demand it be put above everything else is unrealistic. In all my discussions with them, I have tried to be reasonable. Why? Because I know they can walk away from the table at any time. And if they do, we have no recourse.

And don't assume the last sparrow effort was that effective. We barely got started and they immediately reached out with an elaborate plan to approach the issue. I think they were going to do so anyway. They were too ready, too fast. I think they were motivated to fix it simply based on the number of people who had reported the problem on this forum. I also sent them frequent updates on the numbers.

Anyway, they asked for another week. It seemed reasonable. Pissing them off with one week to go seems stupid. If it's not done at the end of the weekend, we put the sparrow back to work and see how effective it is. If we do put the sparrow to work, everyone will need to be involved. It will take effort. The impact will need to be sharp and powerful. Way way bigger than before. I hope it's not necessary.

I agree, Ian. How long it takes is relative. You know that early on when we started this thread that I am a proponent of allowing the business a legitimate chance to fix this. Regardless of when a consumer has an issue with a product ... at least here in the USA has rights.

That being said several things still are an issue besides actual time it's taking DJI to fix it:
1. The tech/customer service is horrible. They either can't communicate effectively or they just plain do not know. Evident by the staffing here in the USA.
2. Communication is horrible. Although they are getting better... they are not proactive and at least appear to wait before we PUSH hard just to get communication of any sort.
3. Chinese consumerism. It's much different than how we operate. It is all bottom line. I mean ask their distributors here in the USA. IF some of you only knew how much distributors are actually getting as profits and how much DJI is actually making on each and every one of us. And to be a distributor you cannot market above what their advertised retail price. Something else has got their attention and it's either more serious or affects their bottom line.

We don't need to "piss" them off... but yeah ... enough is enough. Proof is in the pudding.

I do think that For the money and what you get... that the P2Z is still the best value and best AP Drone out there... but as I said before ... Hubsan 109D Pro= same features as P2Z...h as the 3d gimbal and FPV/iosd/telemtry/screen 2.4 and 5.8 GHz for $500 to $600 price range. The Hubsan was supposed to be due out in spring but i'm sure its going to be here. Oh and did i mention it had 2 extra channels for new accessories? can we say retractable legs?

For a few bucks more than a tricked out FPV GoPro P2... you can get the Walkera Tali H500 Hexacopter with a iLook (gopro copy), 3D gimbal, Full FPV, screen on controller like the hubsan, and RETRACTABLE LEGS!

I know I know... DJI right now is the "Apple Computers" of consumer drones... but that will change very quickly by xmas. So what is my personal plan? Push... because I like DJI. If I didn't care I wouldn't push. I already SOLD my $1500+ investment. Got my money back. By the time they fix this... i'm not sure It would be a P2. I bet they are close to a P3. Or a P2 with retractable struts.

I'm exercising my right to not buy and get rid of my Phantom. I have replaced it with some scratch builds... and although it cost me a little more because I needed better chargers and a better transmitter etc.... it pays for itself after the 2nd aircraft. I even have a FPV AP backyard folding frame quad.

While this thing is fixed... i'm still having fun. haven't filled the Phantom 2 missing "hole"... but I can wait and they need to know I'm going to tell the world what options they have and hit them where it counts... their pocket.

 

[Andy T]

Nobody needs permission to let DJI know they are unhappy. It seems like everybody is waiting for someone else to do something.

 

[ianwood]

I've been involved in many many software projects where the release is delayed by unforseen complications, last minute QA issues, etc. I am not saying that is necessarily the case here but it could be. I also don't see any benefit to a media campaign when they're in the final motions of publishing the fix. I don't see it happening any faster this late in the game.

Conversely, the media campaign is not a trivial effort. It is all or nothing. A couple of chumps posting to FB every day does SFA (look it up if you don't know it). If we wanted to make a meaningful impact that would make DJI jump to attention (and possibly move a little faster), we need at least 25 people posting original content to FB, Youtube, Instagram, Twitter every single day for at least two or three days. That takes a lot of effort to deliver. Creating content, rallying people, coordination, reminders, prodding, prodding, prodding.

Someone needs to step up and marshall all that effort. Call me lazy, but I'd rather wait another week before going through the effort.

 

[Andy T]

Well if nothing else, its been entertaining haha