Fixing DJI's Compass Problem

[varmint]

Borderline relevant at best. And hell freezing over? Cute. Everyone needs a not so gentle reminder that DJI is working on the problem. Ask yourself how many times Apple, Microsoft, Samsung, or other significant tech companies have paid any attention to user forums (especially unofficial ones) and then actually started working on a real fix creating ad hoc test groups to actively work the problem. I can count dozens of defects with products from all those companies where they just ignored it.

So you may have several reasons for bitching about DJI and I am not going to stop you but this thread and others related to it are not set up for griping. They are set up for figuring out ways to fix the problem, hence the title. Please stay on topic.

Hmm, you may need to lighten up a bit. It's called humor. Many people have been completely grounded because of this issue, and others have been grounded for other equally or more important issues (e.g. completely dead video). DJI is taking their sweet time addressing these and many other issues, and to say that there's no room for a little humor when it comes to (in some instances) very long delays for serious problems, is equally ludicrous. No. It wasn't so long ago I saw somebody in this thread asking people to post "get 'er done" banners on DJI's Facebook page and soliciting as many people as possible to bug them about it. Now that you have access to a beta version of a "fix", perhaps your attitude has changed, but not everyone here has been blessed with the privilege.

 

[BigBadFun]

Now that you have access to a beta version of a "fix", perhaps your attitude has changed, but not everyone here has been blessed with the privilege.

Myself and many others have been discussing this elsewhere and completely agree with you. :x

 

[KassioLM]

I'm still flying with 1.08 and I pissed off with declination error, i will change my atitude, until then, Dji is a crap company, they don't answer my mails... Don't give any positions when the problem will be fixed.

 

[d4ddyo]

We have all been patient enough. I like the sarcasm. Nothing wrong with that. And the Sarcasm is on topic. We have a beta test thread. Thats where you guys can stay on topic and give objective findings and possible solutions...

As for my solution... On the borderline about to dump my p2. But I'm making my own.

 

[N017RW]

Now that you have access to a beta version of a "fix", perhaps your attitude has changed, but not everyone here has been blessed with the privilege.

Myself and many others have been discussing this elsewhere and completely agree with you. :x

Stockholm Syndrome?

 

[ianwood]

If anyone assumes I am defending DJI because they gave me a beta firmware, you've assumed incorrectly. I am defending them because they're actually working on the solution. They're actively trying to fix it. You don't beat someone when they're actually trying to fix their mistake. Otherwise they may stop trying.

And if you think I am being a taskmaster, it's probably because I found something counterproductive, detracting from the effort and/or diluting the focus. We're not done yet. I'll risk looking like an a$$hole if that's what it takes to maintain a laser focus on finding the solution for everyone.

NOTE: We started a social media campaign because we weren't getting any response from DJI. And then they responded. If they go quiet again, we will do the same much larger than before. Trust me, if I think they're slacking, I will create a lot of noise and expect everyone else to join in. Right now, they're actively working on it. They are reviewing the beta results and building another beta version.

Let's end this tangent here and get back to the discussion of fixing the compass problem. If you really want to help, look at the results that people are posting up and see if you can figure something out about them.

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=11555&start=370

 

[d4ddyo]

If anyone assumes I am defending DJI because they gave me a beta firmware, you've assumed incorrectly. I am defending them because they're actually working on the solution. They're actively trying to fix it. You don't beat someone when they're actually trying to fix their mistake. Otherwise they may stop trying.

And if you think I am being a taskmaster, it's probably because I found something counterproductive, detracting from the effort and/or diluting the focus. We're not done yet. I'll risk looking like an a$$hole if that's what it takes to maintain a laser focus on finding the solution for everyone.

NOTE: We started a social media campaign because we weren't getting any response from DJI. And then they responded. If they go quiet again, we will do the same much larger than before. Trust me, if I think they're slacking, I will create a lot of noise and expect everyone else to join in. Right now, they're actively working on it. They are reviewing the beta results and building another beta version.

Let's end this tangent here and get back to the discussion of fixing the compass problem. If you really want to help, look at the results that people are posting up and see if you can figure something out about them.

http://www.phantompilots.com/viewtopic. ... &start=370

I'm a paid consumer... In the USA ... We are always right. I'm entitled.

 

[sar104]

I'm a paid consumer... In the USA ... We are always right. I'm entitled.

Sweet. Who pays you? I want some of that deal...

 

[landonkk]

I'm a paid consumer... In the USA ... We are always right. I'm entitled.

Sweet. Who pays you? I want some of that deal...

Lol...

DJI is working on a fix and as long as the beta testers can assure us that the communication is ongoing and work is actually being done (at a decent pace) that is one thing. But we joined the 'project' to get a fix, not to get DJI to work on it. As of now we are only halfway there.

I think a lot of this 'backlash' stems from the fact that beta 3.05, although not perfect, is a large leap forward and those that have access to it are enjoying the added stability of that large leap. I certainly feel, as I am sure others do too, that if I have this issue, why can't I be doing my own beta testing? A 'test group' is a fraction of users representing the overall base of users. Everyone who has reported the problem here is likely a 10 or 15% share of actual users experiencing the issue, so why not let us all be beta testers if we so choose? Open up the beta... make it 'use at your own risk'.

 

[ianwood]

If we open the beta to everyone, it becomes a flood of claims, some accurate, many not. All those claims would need to be verified or debunked. As you can see, we already have some inconsistent results amongst 10 people.

And it's not like we're all just having a party with the beta. Everyone who's doing the beta has agreed to produce videos, to perform specific tests multiple times, and to check in and evaluate each other's results on a regular basis. I am dragging my P2 all the way to Chicago again, not because I want to film there (and I won't be) but to do more tests. I don't even have a case for it yet!

Maybe DJI will ask for more participants on the next beta version which will probably hit this week. It's not uncommon to expand betas as you get closer to release. I will check. The current testers were chosen based on specific declinations, duration and frequency of participation in the discussion, ability to provide objective, useful and interesting insight into it. There's certainly plenty more people here that I think would be good at providing additional analysis. We'll see.

 

[varmint]

Your work and that of the other testers is most definately appreciated. I just wish it didn't take a campaign such as the one you mounted to get anything accomlished with these people. As a developer who works with aerodynamics and avionics and day in and day out, I simply have a hard time buying DJI is putting forth much of an effort here. They've got to have rooms full of engineers; How much of an effort does it really take to properly calibrate a GPS? This doesn't exactly require Apollo 13 level improvisation or ingenuity, and I don't need to be in the trenches to know that.

Anyway, I digress, and will stop bitching, because you're right, it's not going to help. But it feels pretty damned good either way.

 

[Andy T]

I simply have a hard time buying DJI is putting forth much of an effort here
Anyway,

I digress, and will stop bitching, because you're right, it's not going to help. But it feels pretty damned good either way.

Without complaints they wouldn't be doing anything, it definitely helps. I agree DJI are not putting in much effort. the firmware probably could have been rebuilt from scratch is less time then they have been screwing around here. They have some intern playing with it for a couple of hours a week or something. It's a joke. They are using volunteers here when they should be using their worldwide dealers and service people doing it, but from my experience their dealers can be useless too. I wish this issue would go viral and they would go broke so someone that can actually run a company like this would take over.

 

[Lenny7118]

I agree with Andy T it's going on 3 to 4 months now and no friggin fix. They have it release the friggin 3.05 already and make whatever tweaks you (DJI) needs to make while it's been released . My other rant is that the beta testers have the 3.05 fix and flying ok while all of us others have to worry about crashes and safety issues because of flying an unstable phantom. I said it when the problem was made known that DJI won't have a fix out for months and months.
There's not enough people bitching for the release of the fix.

 

[sar104]

I agree with Andy T it's going on 3 to 4 months now and no friggin fix. They have it release the friggin 3.05 already and make whatever tweaks you (DJI) needs to make while it's been released . My other rant is that the beta testers have the 3.05 fix and flying ok while all of us others have to worry about crashes and safety issues because of flying an unstable phantom. I said it when the problem was made known that DJI won't have a fix out for months and months.
There's not enough people bitching for the release of the fix.

I understand your frustration but, just for the record, I don't regard 3.05 as a fix, and I'm not using it to fly except for beta testing. I only have it installed on one of my P2s for that reason. I believe that if they released it now then it would be very premature and that it would lead to a landslide of further complaints.

As an interim solution, you may find that rotating the compass by twice the local declination is a better fix, as several users have described.

 

[KassioLM]

the new logo of the forum by chance would be an analogy to the problem j-hook and TBE of phantom? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[landonkk]

I understand your frustration but, just for the record, I don't regard 3.05 as a fix, and I'm not using it to fly except for beta testing. I only have it installed on one of my P2s for that reason. I believe that if they released it now then it would be very premature and that it would lead to a landslide of further complaints.

As an interim solution, you may find that rotating the compass by twice the local declination is a better fix, as several users have described.

By all reports Beta 3.05 at the very least improves the declination issue except for a few minor issues and even those are likely present in the latest public release. How would it cause a "landslide" of complaints?

I will say this again, as Lenny has echoed my thoughts, Project Drunken Sparrow's GOAL was to get a FIX to the magnetic declination error issue. We still do not have one. We are making progress because there has been a response, but why should we just shut up and be quiet before our goal is reached? So they are working on it.... Great. Work faster! The fact that DJI is leisurely dealing with this is in the first place is because we raised enough of a stink they felt they had to. Logic would indicate that if we kept the pressure on, they might work a little faster.

The psychology of perception is also at play here. Those that are included in the testing feel obligated to defend DJI because the perception is they are now part of the team working towards a solution and it is only natural to defend yourself. And those who are waiting for a fix now perceive the testers as part of the problem because they are working with DJI and won't release what we have so far to everyone. We should all, testers especially, remember to view things from the other side.

After a few months of trying to initialize a response, It has now been three weeks since we first heard back from DJI and they sent out the beta. That is plenty of time to get the fix implemented and released to the public if they were working diligently on it. It is clear they are not.... at least not as fast as we should be demanding to accomplish our original goal!

I originally posted that we should ramp up the Project again on the 19th, but as Ianwood stated, there should be a second beta sent out this week. We should give them one more week, but after that come on.... It would be hard for anyone to argue that it is not getting ridiculous at that point.

 

[ElGuano]

After a few months of trying to initialize a response, It has now been three weeks since we first heard back from DJI and they sent out the beta. That is plenty of time to get the fix implemented and released to the public if they were working diligently on it. It is clear they are not.... at least not as fast as we should be demanding to accomplish our original goal!

I don't have a dog in this fight (I don't get the hook and have one of the first videos of a P1 showing straight flight in a high-dec location), but I did want to chime on the statement above. I work directly with multiple teams on public facing web and mobile services, software and operating system launches, and the above cannot be farther from the truth. Software release management is complicated process, and what seems like a simple change on the outside more often than not has multiple dependencies and cascading effects, all of which need to be carefully designed, documented, and tested against, including unit, integration and/or regression testing, verification and validation, etc. And this is just standard industry practice, not even taking into account a scenario where a failure could end up endangering or destroying property or causing physical injury. And this error is geographically-distributed and variable as well, meaning iterative changes require coordination of testing and validation across global regions.

I'm not saying it's wrong to push a manufacturer to prioritize a fix, but IME the statement above is inconsistent with basic release management methodologies for software or embedded systems.

 

[JoeatBarrett]

(duplicate) Server is throwing an error "unknown field topic_id"

 

[JoeatBarrett]

If we open the beta to everyone, it becomes a flood of claims, some accurate, many not. All those claims would need to be verified or debunked. As you can see, we already have some inconsistent results amongst 10 people.

And it's not like we're all just having a party with the beta. Everyone who's doing the beta has agreed to produce videos, to perform specific tests multiple times, and to check in and evaluate each other's results on a regular basis. I am dragging my P2 all the way to Chicago again, not because I want to film there (and I won't be) but to do more tests. I don't even have a case for it yet!

Maybe DJI will ask for more participants on the next beta version which will probably hit this week. It's not uncommon to expand betas as you get closer to release. I will check. The current testers were chosen based on specific declinations, duration and frequency of participation in the discussion, ability to provide objective, useful and interesting insight into it. There's certainly plenty more people here that I think would be good at providing additional analysis. We'll see.

I've been monitoring the two main topics for this for a month or so but never posted. Ian, I originally found your PDF about the problem after it took me a long time to figure out how to describe it to Google Great work and I'm thankful for your work on this. I have since grounded my Phantom 2 (GoPro Hero3+ Black on H2-3D with mini iOSD and AVL58 FPV) since our purpose is to do aerial shots and footage of the honors campus here at ASU and I don't trust it with the buildings around here. A friend of mine who is a real estate agent had gotten a Phantom 2 earlier in the spring and I recently mentioned this issue to him and he had thought the TBE behavior was "normal operation" LOL!

I'm in Tempe, AZ with declination +10.66

Something else that I had seen my Phantom 2 (firmware 3.0) is an occasional yaw "twitch" as it is flying forward or reverse, and sometimes when just in a hover. Not sure if it could be related to the compass issue, but it certainly prevents me from getting great "dolly shots" and I can't correct it with stabilization in post.

Anyways, we just got the Phantom in late April, and I grounded it after about 15 flights, but I'd be happy to test with the newer beta software coming out. Although I'm sure you probably have more experienced users ready to test it though.

 

[sar104]

I understand your frustration but, just for the record, I don't regard 3.05 as a fix, and I'm not using it to fly except for beta testing. I only have it installed on one of my P2s for that reason. I believe that if they released it now then it would be very premature and that it would lead to a landslide of further complaints.

As an interim solution, you may find that rotating the compass by twice the local declination is a better fix, as several users have described.

By all reports Beta 3.05 at the very least improves the declination issue except for a few minor issues and even those are likely present in the latest public release. How would it cause a "landslide" of complaints?

I will say this again, as Lenny has echoed my thoughts, Project Drunken Sparrow's GOAL was to get a FIX to the magnetic declination error issue. We still do not have one. We are making progress because there has been a response, but why should we just shut up and be quiet before our goal is reached? So they are working on it.... Great. Work faster! The fact that DJI is leisurely dealing with this is in the first place is because we raised enough of a stink they felt they had to. Logic would indicate that if we kept the pressure on, they might work a little faster.

The psychology of perception is also at play here. Those that are included in the testing feel obligated to defend DJI because the perception is they are now part of the team working towards a solution and it is only natural to defend yourself. And those who are waiting for a fix now perceive the testers as part of the problem because they are working with DJI and won't release what we have so far to everyone. We should all, testers especially, remember to view things from the other side.

After a few months of trying to initialize a response, It has now been three weeks since we first heard back from DJI and they sent out the beta. That is plenty of time to get the fix implemented and released to the public if they were working diligently on it. It is clear they are not.... at least not as fast as we should be demanding to accomplish our original goal!

I originally posted that we should ramp up the Project again on the 19th, but as Ianwood stated, there should be a second beta sent out this week. We should give them one more week, but after that come on.... It would be hard for anyone to argue that it is not getting ridiculous at that point.

Your "perception" observations are probably astute, and just to be clear - I completely agree that it is appropriate to keep up the pressure - my point was that I'm unconvinced that releasing the beta is appropriate. Why do I think there would be a landslide of complaints? Because even if it is no worse than the present firmware, and even if it fixes the problem in some cases, the continued problems will lead, as always happens, to accusations of releasing half-assed firmware that should still be in beta.

As for how long it should take - I'm not defending DJI and I'm on record saying that I do not understand, based on my conclusions on the nature of the problem, why there is not a simple and quick fix already implemented. But, if it turns out that it isn't simple, then claiming that it should already be fixed is just guesswork.