Crash from 80 feet, total destruction

[Evel_Knievel]

What purpose dose the CSC midflight have? And don't tell me last ditch effort to avoid a collision...because if anyone has ever done this it was a stunt in my mind. Why doesn't DJI have ONLY the throttle down (single stick) engine kill? I'm talking about the one that we use to hand catch. The one that only kills the engine once the bird senses it isn't descending. Just don't see any reason to have anything else. Tell me what I'm missing, please.

 

[Mal_PV2_Ireland]

Lol, I knew from the start it might go down for any reason, that's why I took my P2v+ with me to the lake. The Phantom's are great flying machines, the P3's range is amazing. It's great, I am not a troll, I love my birds. All I am saying as the OP, How is it that you can shut down motors in mid flight?

You're no troll man, just a guy like the rest of us who would be well pissed with an expensive investment doing a swan dive.

 

[dalebb]

You're no troll man, just a guy like the rest of us who would be well pissed with an expensive investment doing a swan dive.

More like a belly flop.

 

[Mal_PV2_Ireland]

What purpose dose the CSC midflight have? And don't tell me last ditch effort to avoid a collision...because if anyone has ever done this it was a stunt in my mind. Why doesn't DJI have ONLY the throttle down (single stick) engine kill? I'm talking about the one that we use to hand catch. The one that only kills the engine once the bird senses it isn't descending. Just don't see any reason to have anything else. Tell me what I'm missing, please.

I said it earlier, it's very sensible for a machine with moving parts to have a kill switch even if it only has to be used once in a million times. Not really a comparison but remember when bench saws and garbage trucks didn't have a kill switch. It's a redundancy system and probably a ce or fcc requirement needed to sell it in certain parts of the world

 

[Mal_PV2_Ireland]

Right gents, it's 4.30am into Monday morning. I'm off to sleep for an hour or 2. Chat yall tomorrow

 

[Altanore]

How advanced these quad copters are, I don't know how DJI could have overlooked this. It knows how high it is when it has a good GPS signal so it should know not to go into a suicide mission. Even without GPS, it can see the ground. At least have an option to disable it or have it timed. Very interesting read! Hopefully DJI creates a fix for this in a later firmware update.

 

[Evel_Knievel]

I said it earlier, it's very sensible for a machine with moving parts to have a kill switch even if it only has to be used once in a million times. Not really a comparison but remember when bench saws and garbage trucks didn't have a kill switch. It's a redundancy system and probably a ce or fcc requirement needed to sell it in certain parts of the world

Fair enough IF that's the answer. Still don't think it makes sense though because a few folks will accidentally execute the kill procedure and send a 3 pound piece of equipment hurling towards to the earth from God knows what altitude. I can think of a couple far fetched situations where one might actually want to kill the thing midair BUT far fetched they are, and doubt anyone will ever do them.

 

[Incognito]

Just thinking out the box here , wonder if some smart person could come up with a way to clip something to
one of the sticks that would stop the stick just short of full movement to the CSC positions , but movable to
allow motor start up ?

I dont have my P3 yet but from the specs ive seen something as simple as a tight fitting O ring at the base of the stick would do it no?
then if your flying in a slightly more dangerous situations you could always roll the o ring up the stick so you have access to the kill switch like wise when starting up roll the o ring up start it up, roll it down to fly.

maybe somebody might like to try this lol

 

[ianwood]

1. CSC is in the manual. Hopefully, it's existence is not a surprise to anyone.
2. CSC is there as a safety precaution because of the 4 sharpish spinny thingies.
3. 100% down, 100% yaw, 100% elevator, 100% aileron is just a tad much to do all at the same time. Or to be more specific, it's insanely much. If you want to fly like that, you might want something a little more acrobatic than the P3.

 

[Meta4]

How advanced these quad copters are, I don't know how DJI could have overlooked this. It knows how high it is when it has a good GPS signal so it should know not to go into a suicide mission. Even without GPS, it can see the ground. At least have an option to disable it or have it timed. Hopefully DJI creates a fix for this in a later firmware update.

To back up what Ian just said ... this feature is not a bug, it's not something that DJI overlooked and it doesn't need fixing.
It's in the manual and publicised whenever there is the occasional incident like this.
But whenever something like this happens it's always accompanied by new flyers calling for DJI to fix this "problem".
It has been the standard emergency stop feature since the Phantom 1 at least and it hasn't resulted in Phantoms falling out of the sky in normal flight.
Putting a 3 second delay or a second chance warning would defeat the whole purpose of having an emergency stop.
It uses the joysticks because that's where the pilot's fingers are while flying, ready for instant activation.

You have to be flying like a mad chimp to accidentally hit the CSC position and that just isn't something that happens in normal flight or by accident.
It hasn't yet been confirmed that this was the cause of the OP's crash - there are other possible causes.

 

[apocnz]

CSC is actually a good thing to have. I did CSC right after the bird strike, because I don't want my Phantom flying awol into something or someone. As a safety measure, if your not in control, the best option is to cut power (I guess depending on the situation).

I'd be more comfortable having CSC as combo option (ie, sticks down inwards and then outwards), to prevent accidentally performing it mid air ...

 

[Chris P Duck]

Agree CSC is essential.
Say you get a bird strike, a prop is damaged which means your bird is now 100% out of your control.
If it was heading to water / a road / people / buildings etc I'd want to kill it immediately. No 3 seconds, just off. Only way I could have ANY control over where I crash it.
If it were heading for people I'd at the very least want to stop the props spinning before it got there...

As for a dedicated button...
I bet there'd be a lot more of these threads from people that accidentally hit the button! Maybe you should need to do the CSC while also pressing the shutter button or something but the more complex you make it the longer it will take you to execute it in a panicked state when your looking at your bird not the remote.

The CSC should not be hit in normal flying with a P3, if you wanted a stunt quad (and I have nothing against this at all) buy something designed for it, it'll also be a crap load cheaper.

Sorry but 100% pilot error, 0% design flaw.

 

[Mal_PV2_Ireland]

You have to be flying like a mad chimp to accidentally hit the CSC position and that just isn't something that happens in normal flight or by accident.

Best description ever! Haha

 

[Hughie]

I think a three second delay to shut down mid air makes sense. What would require you to shut down instantly?

Absolutely necessary for it to be immediate. If you have to avoid another aircraft quickly, it is usually the best option.

At least have a button or switch completely separate from normal flight controls if you must have a self destruct button.

Yes I agree - there should be an interlock switch which you have to press as well - or at least some other mechanism to prevent accidental use.

 

[bbfpv]

Also, @dalebb, Course Lock would have been a perfect fit for what you were trying to film. Orient the bird so instead of having to hold the pitch stick down to fly in reverse, you press it up. No threat of CSC.

 

[Ezookiel]

I love gimbals, but I hate how damned fragile they are.
Last two crashes I've had, - one just from the height of my ceiling down to a carpeted floor - no more than 8 feet max, completely totalled my H3-3D, and then another crash from the same height (slowed and cushioned by trees) has left the replacement H3-3D sitting at a weird angle I can't seem to straighten.

Hope you are back up and flying soon.

 

[Oso]

This thread has me paranoid. I'm never reckless, but I'm not 100% sure that I won't do an accidental midair CSC.

I instinctively pull back to go up, so I always fly with a custom set inverted left stick. The CSC for me is not the same as the default. Every time I read the manual or read a related thread, I need to convert the left stick up/down in my mind. Same for first person shooter games. I need to invert the controls to have any chance of survival. Pulling back to go down just makes no sense to me.

One thing I think should be clearer is the manual. It has a one sentence warning of a midair CSC. For something so devastating and also possibly an emergency maneuver tactic, a midair CSC should have had more attention and clarity in the manual.

To a much less urgent degree, an overheated battery not charging until it's cooler should have also been given more attention and clarity in the manual. Do you guys remember the initial panic from new fliers when their batteries would not charge?

 

[JayB]

Absolutely necessary for it to be immediate. If you have to avoid another aircraft quickly, it is usually the best option.


Yes I agree - there should be an interlock switch which you have to press as well - or at least some other mechanism to prevent accidental use.

I am totally new to Phantom flying and as soon as I knew about CSC I became paranoid that I was going to do it accidentally....I haven't yet.

I agree it has to be instant as it is for emergencies but why not use the right shoulder wheel or shutter button as the interlock switch, I think this easy update would put a lot of new pilots at ease and hopefully prevent unintentional CSC and you could still use CSC to instantly stop the phantom if required.

 

[bbfpv]

It doesn't matter what the stick combo or button press is in order to stop the motors mid flight. When enough people are in the air, there will always be a few that accidentally do it.

 

[Hughie]

I am totally new to Phantom flying and as soon as I knew about CSC I became paranoid that I was going to do it accidentally....I haven't yet.

I agree it has to be instant as it is for emergencies but why not use the right shoulder wheel or shutter button as the interlock switch, I think this easy update would put a lot of new pilots at ease and hopefully prevent unintentional CSC and you could still use CSC to instantly stop the phantom if required.

I agree with all that, but you must put it in context. There have been very many users through these forums over the last couple of years. The number of intentional cases of this happening which I am aware of is zero.... until now.

Many years ago, I used to work on Martin Baker ejection seats used in fighter aircraft. Once you have removed the pin the ejection handles are very easy to pull. I never heard a pilot complaining that they would rather have them so accidents would not happen.

The only way an CSC is going to happen on a Phantom is if the pilot is inputting movements for which he has no expectations of at the time he makes them. Sort of "stirring the paint pot". Why would anyone fly like that. It beats me.