If you just purchased a brand new Phantom 2 Vision+ V3 READ!

[burlbark]

It was never an issue to begin with, so I am sure DJI has done nothing. Other than a handful of flights on early P2v+ V3 quads, there have been few problems. If this was truly an "undersized wire" problem or soldering problem, the number of these that would have crashed would have been so great that no one would buy one, and the media would be all over it.

Do yourself a favor, don't be panicked every time a post comes up on these forums about a perceived problem or fix for your quad. Most of the time it is guesswork and speculation on the part of the person giving the diagnosis.

Nothing personal to those who are genuinely trying to help, but DJI pays engineers millions of dollars to design and test these things. They don't get everything perfect all the time, but to think that there are problems and fixes like this forum talks about is really more opinion than science.

You obviously are new here..... Did you bother to look back through the last 10 pages to see DJI's attempt at fixing this? Probably not, no absolutely not, and spouting that every thing is fine does not add to this thread and I wish I could delete your post.

You dont repair these quads nearly daily and see the damage the broken wires cause. Gimbal gone, body smashed, legs broken, 1-4 esc's damaged, 1-4 motors damaged, Gps antenna cracked, main board plugs broken off, battery case cracked, cells damaged.

Will all solid wires in the flexing vibrating arm break? I dont know, but probably, eventually they all will unless the owner loses it to a fly away or user error results in a crash.

How many flight before they fail? One long term flyer reported 50 flights before they broke off, some have reported half a dozen.

We dont see crashes with the multistranded wires separating at the esc unless the motor or arm separate. We see crashed birds with solid esc wires often having broken motor leads.

There is no reason for the solid motor wires to break in a crash unless it was fatigue. There is extra length on them to allow some twisting. They are most often the cause of the flip of death in the Vision line.

Jeremy

 

[Jstic]

I thought you guys started this discussion out by boldly claiming that the entire problem was undersized wiring. Now someone else comes here and questions your results and conclusions, and you ask them to take their post down? So which is it, undersized wiring, bad soldering, or vibration. Why hasn't DJI come out and announced this problem and recalled all the V3 quads?

We have taken a few of the newer units apart and repaired them, we are seeing nothing from DJI that would indicate a change from the original V3 design. What is "DJI's attempt at fixing this"?

Nothing personal, but I will take the word of DJI and the engineers and electricians that they pay over a couple of guys who apparently do home repairs on these quads.

Are you an authorized repair shop for DJI?

What I and others don't like and disagree with you on is the way you present your case based on a very small amount of failures, which you do not know the cause of with certainty. I don't know the number of V3's sold and in use but it has to be in the tens of thousands. I review and follow the message boards closely and quite frankly, there have only been a handful of these fatal crashes which you adamantly attribute to these wiring problems. And a few of those were V2 owners trying to upgrade to the newer motors and getting a mismatch with the proper ESC. We are probably talking about less than 1% of all V3's sold, and you boldly recommend and encourage people NOT TO FLY them in their stock condition. You should think about removing some of those posts.

It's also interesting to know that you will likely increase your repair business and make a tidy profit based on your theories and recommendations. It would be nice to have a more objective source.

 

[Jstic]

It's laughable to even suggest that DJI is paying millions of dollars to their engineers who use solid wire in a vibrating environment. I'd bet their top quality control guy dosen't even have a basic electronics degree to not realize that. And, then, instead of replacing the solid wires with stranded wires like they should, their well-paid electronic geniuses decide to just add a huge glob of silicone caulking onto the ESCs. Yeah.. Real stellar engineering worth millions.

http://www.phantompilots.com/attachments/20150412_192406-jpg.17068/

Still bashing DJI's products, eh? Do you have any idea how hypocritical it makes you look to claim that you "love flying" your DJI quad, yet you come on these forums just about every day and bash them or complain vehemently about their quality?

I generally don't buy and use products that I believe are poorly made, unsafe, and could seriously hurt someone or someone's property, especially ones that fly. But apparently you do.

And of course you are an electrical engineer and have a "basic electronics degree" which puts you in the unique position of being able to criticize and pass judgment on DJI's products, right?

I didn't think so.

 

[MapMaker53]

LOL. I'm detecting a Chinese accent.

 

[Jstic]

LOL. I'm detecting a Chinese accent.

Come on, who do you work for, Walkera or some other competitor? I mean no one is really stupid enough to cry, whine, complain about and criticize a company's products for months and months, and then go out and buy and use them, are they?

Aside from listening to forum gibberish, what's your background in repairing and diagnosing problems with the P2V+? I mean you must be basing your constant criticisms on something other than what you hear on an internet forum. I guess not.

 

[MapMaker53]

Seriously.. are you on some sort of medication?

 

[N017RW]

It's been said before but isn't too sexy I guess.

The breakages at the ESC-motor solder wire interface is most likely caused by improper insulation stripping.
The method used is unknown but the result of pinching the wire sets the failure in motion. This combined with no strain relief will concentrate the stress and the weakest point wins (or loses/fails actually). Their 'patch' of adding silicone strain relief should suffice.

Unless you've ever worked in a manufacturing environment you don't have any idea how often this happens.

The pressure on these poor workers to meet production goals is tremendous. If you've ever seen or been to high-volume manufacturer you'd know what I'm talking about.

Remember the Apple folks committing suicide? They had to put nets around their multistory buildings to try and prevent it.

You know what they say about going into the kitchen of a restaurant?... Don't!

Now after your done slamming DJI for all the incompetence you feel they exhibit, why not turn your sights on GM. People died. That should keep you busy for a while.

 

[madeinengland]

It's been said before but isn't too sexy I guess.

The breakages at the ESC-motor solder wire interface is most likely caused by improper insulation stripping.
The method used is unknown but the result of pinching the wire sets the failure in motion. This combined with no strain relief will concentrate the stress and the weakest point wins (or loses/fails actually). Their 'patch' of adding silicone strain relief should suffice.

Unless you've ever worked in a manufacturing environment you don't have any idea how often this happens.

The pressure on these poor workers to meet production goals is tremendous. If you've ever seen or been to high-volume manufacturer you'd know what I'm talking about.

Remember the Apple folks committing suicide? They had to put nets around their multistory buildings to try and prevent it.

You know what they say about going into the kitchen of a restaurant?... Don't!

Now after your done slamming DJI for all the incompetence you feel they exhibit, why not turn your sights on GM. People died. That should keep you busy for a while.

If it were me i would have those solid wires out of there or at least checked like a shot.
The obvious problem to me is the very great likelihood of the solid wire being nicked when removing the insulation before soldering.The slightest nick to a solid conductor makes it useless and vibration will cause it to break at the soldering point.I don't think heat is such a great threat in this case.

 

[burlbark]

I thought you guys started this discussion out by boldly claiming that the entire problem was undersized wiring. Now someone else comes here and questions your results and conclusions, and you ask them to take their post down? So which is it, undersized wiring, bad soldering, or vibration. Why hasn't DJI come out and announced this problem and recalled all the V3 quads?

We have taken a few of the newer units apart and repaired them, we are seeing nothing from DJI that would indicate a change from the original V3 design. What is "DJI's attempt at fixing this"?

Nothing personal, but I will take the word of DJI and the engineers and electricians that they pay over a couple of guys who apparently do home repairs on these quads.

Are you an authorized repair shop for DJI?

What I and others don't like and disagree with you on is the way you present your case based on a very small amount of failures, which you do not know the cause of with certainty. I don't know the number of V3's sold and in use but it has to be in the tens of thousands. I review and follow the message boards closely and quite frankly, there have only been a handful of these fatal crashes which you adamantly attribute to these wiring problems. And a few of those were V2 owners trying to upgrade to the newer motors and getting a mismatch with the proper ESC. We are probably talking about less than 1% of all V3's sold, and you boldly recommend and encourage people NOT TO FLY them in their stock condition. You should think about removing some of those posts.

It's also interesting to know that you will likely increase your repair business and make a tidy profit based on your theories and recommendations. It would be nice to have a more objective source.

I have done everything open source. I have shown how to do it and and have helped everyone that has asked. I have made a couple thousand off of replacing motor wires..... I will gladly send everyone that requests this service on over to you, if you can prove you are competent enough to do the job and show some examples of your work...... This is not about the money this is about them failing.

Originally the wires and the insulation where melting, this was caused by couple different things.
1. The esc flashing was causing the fets to stay open to long and creating an over current situation.
2. The small diameter wire did not have the surface area to dissipate the heat generated by the high current levels. The airflow over the motors and the additional mass there allowed the motors to not overheat but not the leads.
So yes initially the wire diameter was questionable and could not keep up.

Then we had version Yellow esc's with 2.1 flashing that developed less heat on the motor leads. This is where we are now, along with the DJI attempt at a fix(gooped silicone or shrink wrapped wires to esc).

What this all resulted in is discontinued model..... So that is the fix and why there is no recall. I hope you can understand and if you cant stick around this forum is a great place to exercise the mind.

I am not an authorized DJI repair man. I get them back quick because of this.....

Jeremy

 

[MapMaker53]

Your repair services and how you have spent your time getting to the bottom of the various P2V+ failure issues and helping all in this forum by sharing the information and fixes speaks for itself, burlbark. I for one appreciate it.

 

[BlackTracer]

Your repair services and how you have spent your time getting to the bottom of the various P2V+ failure issues and helping all in this forum by sharing the information and fixes speaks for itself, burlbark. I for one appreciate it.

Me three. I frequent these forums and have witnessed many of Mr. James' posts and what I consider expert analysis. Seems to me he has been here to help, not to try and drum up business for himself, although that is a good side effect for him. More power to him. The guy is not going to retire by fixing faulty v3's or crashed P2's. Anyone who thinks if there was a faulty piece of hardware that DJI would have recalled it and replaced it for all owner's is on crack. They have shown time and again this is not the case. The unholy wifi units which are pitifully heatsinked is the best example to me. These are frying left and right and DJI couldn't care less. And thanks to guys like member Burlbark, his research and knowledge and youtube videos have helped many fix this issue and avoid a costly repair (replacing a burnt up wifi unit). FYI I don't know Burlbark personally, but through these forums I have gathered he is a stand up kinda guy, not a fraud.

 

[Marlin009]

I thought you guys started this discussion out by boldly claiming that the entire problem was undersized wiring. Now someone else comes here and questions your results and conclusions, and you ask them to take their post down? So which is it, undersized wiring, bad soldering, or vibration. Why hasn't DJI come out and announced this problem and recalled all the V3 quads?

We have taken a few of the newer units apart and repaired them, we are seeing nothing from DJI that would indicate a change from the original V3 design. What is "DJI's attempt at fixing this"?

Nothing personal, but I will take the word of DJI and the engineers and electricians that they pay over a couple of guys who apparently do home repairs on these quads.

Are you an authorized repair shop for DJI?

What I and others don't like and disagree with you on is the way you present your case based on a very small amount of failures, which you do not know the cause of with certainty. I don't know the number of V3's sold and in use but it has to be in the tens of thousands. I review and follow the message boards closely and quite frankly, there have only been a handful of these fatal crashes which you adamantly attribute to these wiring problems. And a few of those were V2 owners trying to upgrade to the newer motors and getting a mismatch with the proper ESC. We are probably talking about less than 1% of all V3's sold, and you boldly recommend and encourage people NOT TO FLY them in their stock condition. You should think about removing some of those posts.

It's also interesting to know that you will likely increase your repair business and make a tidy profit based on your theories and recommendations. It would be nice to have a more objective source.

Clearly, you have not been paying attention.

 

[hunch]

James,
thanks for all the comments. Obviously some "smarties" know more about just reading about it
then actually having hands on actual problem like you and i have in the past.
Jstic, i suggest you open up couple phantoms and go through all the components and
learn a thing or two about them before you join the forums and leave comment like you do.
Just like burlbark said, we don't do it for the money, even thou it's nice to see a $ or $$
come in.
I for one have a full time job and do this part time and weekends and the passion
is what is driving both of us to explore and find the failures in these so that
end user can enjoy their "toys" longer and safer.

my 2c.
hani

 

[fastsmiles]

+1

 

[burlbark]

Thanks Guys, thats why this forum is here and one of the most informative on the web.

 

[hagarthefish]

Dji have changed the esc's from 2.0 to 2.1 after it had been a problem for some time. Now they have added some gloop to cut down vibration. These two things prove to me that the problems were and are real. Changing wire to withstand the vibration is another way to fix the same problem. A better way as far as I can see. The guys here fixing and advising are top blokes, if they make a $ or $$''s then you are paying for a service. The advice is free and can be taken or not.
Dji has recognised the talked about problems and acted on them. Rather than change the wires to them it makes sense to add a little gloop. There goal is max profit.

 

[rymannphilippe]

Hello to all

I have a Phantom 2 Vision+ V3 and i think it falls from the air like a stone because the battery get to cold.
I read this 42 Pages for about 30% and my English is not so good so please help me.
It's a lot of information and for a beginner like me now im out of focus ;-(

I have open my Phantom and rearranged the wires a bit.
Do anybody see another problem or what exactly i have to do for a save flight?

Thanks all.
Philippe


View attachment 17073 View attachment 17074 View attachment 17075

Hello again

Please can somebody check my question and photos please?
I new with my DJI and every time i fly i have this "Feeling" in me something can happen.

Are I safe to fly or do I have upgrade the ESC's?

Thanks and happy flying
Philippe

PS.: Somebody writes my in privat and tells the ESC with the blue marking are the wrong ones.
But I think, this is only a factory check for the Cap is now blown.

 

[Marlin009]

PS.: Somebody writes my in privat and tells the ESC with the blue marking are the wrong ones.
But I think, this is only a factory check for the Cap is now blown.

You asked, I answered. If you don't believe me, fine. Go fly your bird.

 

[morph000]

Mark Twain described education as "that which reveals to the wise, and conceals from the stupid, the vast limits of their knowledge"
So having paid for a piece of paper (qualification) doesn't guarantee anything in the real world.
Einstein did badly at school and dropped out.
I'd sooner trust someone who has extensive real-world experience than some rote-leaning university "expert" blindly regurgitating stuff detached from reality.

 

[Adrian Morris]

i think ive just had this problem trash my bird mine fell out of the sky a couple of days ago, it was only 4 weeks old and had done 14 flights, it was hovering and just dropped on one side and headed down like a missile, vanished out of site, I found it 20mins later it had hit a tree 200 metres away and fell to the ground, smashed to bits gimble and camera destroyed and 3 out of 4 of the motors melted into the frame. was obviously a dead short on one of the motors or a wire coming of the esc, Ive taken it back to dealer who has sent it back to dji ive mailed them 3 times now telling them I don't want it repaired or replaced as I have no confidence in the v3 now after reading all the crap about motors and esc faults and I'm demanding a refund as it was only 4 weeks old, and I want to get the phantom 3 which I hope will not have these issues, so far ive had no reply from dji
Check out video on my site
https://www.youtube.com/c/flightofthephantomuk