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Surveillance Camera Classification

Discussion in 'Phantom 2 Vision Discussion' started by pyrophantom, Apr 3, 2014.

  1. pyrophantom

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    Following the recent conviction of a guy whose quadcopter lost signal and flew off and near to a nuclear submarine testing facility. Rading a bit more it would appear that our innocent little cameras on our phantoms are in fact classed as "surveillance" cameras !! :shock:

    Looking at Buzzflyers info about flying these :


    "First Person View RC Flying.

    FPV RC is a legitimate activity but there are limitations that you must observe to be both legal and insured. ANO Article 166 (3) says the person in charge of a small unmanned aircraft must maintain direct, unaided visual contact with the aircraft sufficient to monitor its flight path in relation to other aircraft, persons, vehicles, vessels and structures for the purpose of avoiding collisions. This is a strict legal requirement.

    The implication for FPV RC is that the pilot ‘under the hood’ cannot, by definition, be the pilot in charge of the model and that there must be a separate ‘pilot in charge’ at all times. After discussions with the insurers and the CAA, BMFA has been able to arrange insurance for the activity but ONLY if the following regulation is followed:

    When flying FPV RC, the pilots MUST use a buddy box system with the pilot in charge using the master transmitter. In addition, the model is equipped with a video camera and video link to the ground and will automatically be classed by the CAA as a small aircraft equipped for surveillance. Consequently, all of ANO Article 167, (Small unmanned surveillance aircraft) will apply to any flights made. This can be read in full in the section ‘Legal Controls over Model Flying’.
    Again, these are strict legal requirements."


    Was a bit concerned that common sense did not prevail in this court case if he ligitmately said he didnt know the facility was there, but maybe he should have foreseen that ?

    :?
     
  2. Pull_Up

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    It's no excuse, just as it isn't in full-scale aviation. Buy a quarter mill air chart of your area for 15 quid and it shows all restricted airspace, etc. Absolutely no excuse if you're doing long range FPV with a fixed wing like this guy. They can go for miles...

    I uploaded a video discussing just this last night - if the CAA does start to look to enforcing the existing rules then there are a lot of youtube videos evidencing people breaching article 167 - particularly those flying above their houses or around their streets in built-up areas. I think it's mainly the sensitivity of the site in this instance that brought the decision to prosecute - we're discussing it so it's had the desired effect from the CAA's point of view...
     
  3. pyrophantom

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    Yes it makes you think a bit and I think its so easy just to take one of these out the box and wander off everywhere, and yes you are right its something which people need to be aware of and ensure they have valid insurance cover and flight logs which can demonstrate they have taken precautions and flown responsibly, which is another good aspect to having the flytrex data I guess.
     
  4. seajunky

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    I have only flown twice at the moment, and made an effort to join my local model flying club, who have their own field and forum to boot. I published my second only flight on their forum, and was politely reminded that it is illegal to fly within 50 meters of a road. Here is the post without identifying the sender.

    "Good effort on your video.

    If I may suggest that you re edit the footage with less of the A55 showing mate! its less than 50m away from the church and considered to be an unsafe distance from the road. Entirely up to you what you want to do. I thought I better mention it.

    Keep up the good work"

    Here is the video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePJNsz9 ... m8fdhXfAMQ

    I am posting this:
    (A) to show that people in the main are trying to be responsible.
    (B) How easy it is to ignorantly fall foul of the law.

    I made that flight in the knowledge that there were rules and regs governing my flying, but didn't realise just how easy it was to break the law. I think we should all discourage bad practice in our hobby before the government feels it has to take a sledge hammer to crack a nut, and ruins our hobby.

    Steve
     
  5. pyrophantom

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    The bit of the CAA regulations I find a little ambiguous with regard to the phantom is where they say...

    ...."must maintain DIRECT UNAIDED visual contact at all times"....

    The DJI app doesn't "Aid" visual contact from flyer to aircraft, merely from aircraft to ground, because as we know at around 500+ feet you can easily lose sight of it and only know where you are because of the fpv image on the app ? I interpret the regulation as saying you must be able to see the aircraft at all times without the use of anything else, not what the vision can see from the app ? That then brings into question all the extended range mods that people can do to make their phantoms wander off into the distance and way out of direct visual sight.

    :?:
     
  6. Mal_PV2_Ireland

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    In fairness I think if you cant see it with your own eyes you are breaking the rules. If you rely on the app or fpv to know where your bird is and the app or fpv connection breaks down you wont know exactly where it is. If that was fully enforced I wouldnt have a problem with that.
     
  7. gpauk

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    Yep.. It's often been pointed out in here (and often by Pull_up :) ) that flying well out of visual range, up into clouds etc is at best a really bad idea.

    You can do extreme range mods and meet the rules. When test flying a 3km+ range I always have a spotter close to the plane, in radio contact with me. And as my reason for range testing is to get rock solid performance in visual range, I usually start and end the test with the copter already at range, and accompanied! You don't have to fly 3km to prove you have 3km range...

    Just downloaded that UK avoid area app... Looks like it should be useful!
     
  8. pyrophantom

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    I know the CAA are probably fairly relaxed about the recreational flying as long as its done responsibly, but makes you think doesn't it ? Im glad I am one of those people who gets twitchy when I can no longer see it with my own eyes, app or no app. Whilst I was reading the CAA regs I noticed in a another document where they wanted to bring in the same regs for under 7kg aircraft as exists currently for over 7kg aircraft, which would be another can of worms. I don't think this has happened yet as far as I can read.

    Feels kinda spooky having a "surveillance" drone lol.......DJI better make them all slopey sided and stealthy looking :lol:
     
  9. MStacey

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    UK Avoid Area App - now where do I get , Whats it called ?

    tried searching the Apple iPhone app store but could not find it. Is it just Android
     
  10. gpauk

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  11. pyrophantom

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