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State, National, Insert Park Name here (banned)?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by stevet, Oct 7, 2014.

  1. stevet

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    I was wondering if anyone knew the list of parks or park <insert state, local, forest> that where banned. Of course we all know of the big one closet to where I live Yosemite, but I also have a cabin in Lake Tahoe which is a National Forest, but a parts of that national forests are state parks and such.

    Anyone have any clarification on this or where the actual list is?
     
  2. stevet

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    Hmm nobody? :)
     
  3. GoodnNuff

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    Currently illegal to fly in any and all National Parks and National Monuments.
    No ban on flying in National Forests.
     
  4. Old Gazer

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    Location:
    Eastern Oklahoma
    No flying in Texas State Parks
     
  5. isky172

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    Personally took a 1 1/2 hr drive to Tallulah Gorge State Park in Northeastern Georgia to fly the Phantom 2 around and get great video (think Grand Canyon but much smaller...and more trees).

    Walked into the whatever-they-call-it center (it's a name only some pablum-puking naturist would love/understand) and asked if we could take pictures/video around the place. Here's how it went;

    "Can we take pictures and video?"
    A: Sure

    "How about aerial pictures and video?"
    A: Sure

    "How about quadcopter video?"
    A: You mean a drone?
    Me: If you want to call it that, yes
    A: No, it's illegal to fly drones in state parks. Mostly because of that time someone flew one into the spring in Yellowstone.

    "Do you have a Grand Prismatic Spring here in the Gorge?"
    A: No.

    "Is it illegal for birds to fly in the Gorge?"
    A: No.

    "What law are you citing, specifically, that says it's against the law to fly in GA state parks?"
    A: Ummm....(no citation)

    "Are you sure it's 'illegal' to fly drones here at the Gorge?"
    A: Yes, sorry

    I walked away thinking my tax dollars support this boob's salary, and this state park. Yet, somehow/someway/for some reason I was told I couldn't fly the drone there. I was thinking about lawyering-up to get the State to recognize they don't have the right to tell me I can't fly in my state park. That was this last weekend. Still somewhat fuming (although more important things in life reclaimed priority a few hours post-trip).

    Trying to think of a place I can stand from (a non-state-park location) and still be able to FPV my way into the Gorge for some great video/photos.
     
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  6. stevet

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    I sent an email to one I found on the national parks site to try to get some clarification but this is really frustrating. So far nobody has given me hell for flying around in Tahoe or asked, I mainly get questions of how much my set up was etc. I wonder who we can bug to get a list, since well sharing is caring and for us to know helps us avoid issues or some one getting into issues w/o knowing.
     
  7. rjstone

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    It doesn't surprise me to find that someone in this particular job doesn't know the exact answer to the question, but it should be surprising if they can't give you the phone number of someone with the authority to comment on legal issues on behalf of the state park system.

    I would call one of these people and see what you can get them to send you in writing, even if only via email: http://gastateparks.org/contact#phone

    If you have trouble getting anyone to take you seriously, I'd suggest that you might suggest to them that you may at some point in the future (which is true since it's solidly within the realm of possibility) organize a large gathering of people for a trip to a state park and that it would be extremely helpful if someone with proper legal authority to speak for the state park system could state the park system's position in writing along with citations of the actual laws involved. After all, someone at a large gathering could possibly be a lawyer or someone with lots of money who might find it worthwhile to challenge any less-than-diligent claims made by the state park system that aren't well founded with detailed references to existing law.

    This is all hypothetical of course and I wouldn't suggest getting into any legal battles with the state, but of course things like that tend to happen regardless of what anyone advises (since someone out there will want to) so the people in the state park system will probably want to take that possibility, or perhaps inevitability, seriously. Hopefully they also take protecting the parks seriously and will want to make sure they're on sound legal footing if they're trying to claim that something dangerous is banned from state parks. But of course this is just me "hoping" for ideal things since I don't really know the exact nature of the situation.
     
  8. usaken

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    National Parks, National Recreation Areas and National Monuments are all off limits. Here in the San Francisco Bay area recently, drone pilots have been cited for flying at Crissy Field. It's kind of a shame, all the Bay Area ocean facing beaches from Ocean Beach all the way to Point Reyes (except Muir Beach) are off limits. As an American Citizen and tax payer I feel that these are my beaches and parks too!
     
  9. Happyflyer

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    If that is the "Dog Park" I am thinking of, it sure would be a neat place to fly. The doggies sure would get a kick out of chasing a quad up and down that beach area. I had a blast watching the dogs have fun back in '05....and I'm a cat person.
    .
    I called and ask the State Park Super about flying at the beach here in Michigan. Only thing he was concerned about was not to scare the special birds nesting at the beach at that time. But he did state pictures from up high would be nice to have of that area. I respected the birdies and went to a different place.
     
  10. Dragonrider

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    You should have stopped asking questions when he/she said "Sure" when you asked "How about aerial pictures and video?".........
     
  11. rjstone

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    What are they being cited with violating though? The park service can't make up their own laws so they have to be cited with violating some existing law. Then there's the issue of whether citing someone with vague catch-all laws like "disturbing the peace" will hold up in court, if that's the sort of thing they're citing people with.

    I have no problem with banning drones around places like Rainbow Springs in Yellowstone, or even Yellowstone as a whole, but it sounds like "drones" (remote controlled aircraft) are being banned in places where there's no reason to ban them "just because" or "out of an abundance of caution." However you could also just ban people from national park areas "out of an abundance of caution" if "abundance of caution" or "precautionary principle' is your only reasoning for anything. Real decision making and real leadership requires cost/risk/benefit analysis. Is anyone even attempting to do anything like this, or is banning all humans from national parks next on the list?
     
  12. GoodnNuff

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    Interesting. While searching for the law that temporarily bans drones in National Parks (Crissy Field) and Monuments, I ran across this: http://act.credoaction.com/sign/drones_national_parks

    I'd love to fly in some of our NPs, especially in my home state of Utah - there are some incredible landscapes in the southwest. But as an annual NP pass holder, I've enjoyed our parks all my life and will continue to whether I can fly my toy there are not.
    Viewing Delicate Arch at sunset just wouldn't be the same with a drone in my LOS, let alone a cluster of them.
     
  13. rjstone

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    That looks like it's written by the same sort of idiots who want to ban absolutely everything except pot and whatever else they personally want to do or use. Essentially it's written by one of these "if I don't enjoy doing something then it should be banned!!!" types. Is there a way to sign a petition AGAINST this petition?
     
  14. CarlJ

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    There will always be a ban in place at Grand Canyon NP because of the dangers inherit in that park, but they may allow flying in parts or part of the Kiabab National Forest. Expect PS to roll these changes out on a park by park basis after they've had a chance to study the impart on wildlife and other criteria, and it could be years before we see designated flying areas.

    Rules have always varied from park to park depending on many factors, chief among them is the safety of the park's visitors, and impact to wildlife. It's no surprise, and no secret how PS and the Department of Interior make their decisions with regard to the parks.

    I'm very doubtful that any petition that does not address safety or the protection of wildlife will sway them.
     
  15. shlepr

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    Valley Forge NP has a flying field maintained by a local R/C club. I believe you can get a one day pass to fly there from the Welcome Center, if not a member of the club and have a vald AMA card.
     
  16. Happyflyer

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    They are incredible. I just hope I can get to go back and see Delicate and all the others some day. Beautiful place.
     
  17. tvleaker

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    I have asked about Texas State Parks and they had no specific restrictions on drones unless it has happened very recently. I have flown in Texas State Parks with no problem. Just use common sense. If you call and ask, they told me no specific regulations



    here is a link to Texas State Park regulations. nothing about drones
    http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/spdest/park ... gulations/
     
  18. Indy_Mike

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    It looks like a No to Indiana state parks.
    • Motor Driven Airborne Devices: Motor-driven airborne devices (RC airplanes) should be operated in designated areas only or with clearance from property management. Drones are not currently permitted on DNR properties.
    • Use of DNR Property by Private Organizations: Special Events Permit/License. If an individual, business or other group wishes to host an event such as a public meeting, parade, contest, competition, sporting activity or other special event or activity on a DNR property, that individual or organization must obtain a Special Events Permit/License as required by 312 IAC 8-2-15. The application for a license/permit can be obtained by contacting the property manager at the location where the event is proposed. The application should be completed and submitted for review at least 30 days prior to the event, and must be approved prior to any publicity for the event. An application fee of $25 is required, and additional fees may apply depending on the nature of the event.
     
  19. tcope

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    As mentioned, can't fly at National Parks. However, these parks cover a _LOT_ of area that is miles and miles and miles from anyone. If you were to fly a drone and no one was around or 10 (?) miles... I doubt anyone would cite you.

    Also, feel free to fly at Goblin Sate Park. Last I heard, they did not mind so long as you don't bother anyone. That is the way it should be.
     
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  20. tcope

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    I suspect you will see a lot of this in this thread. People saying you can't fly without really knowing and people saying you can't fly because this is what they were told even though the person doing the "telling" was wrong. You will also have some people where who read a law and only think it applies to personal flying of drones when it really does not (FL laws come to mind).