POLICE WORK

[lpmccormick]

I am a newly certified pilot for a municipality. The police department here has requested to use me at their convenience. I am just curious if anyone out there is doing anything similar and how they have gone about their operations, as far as what all they have done, bypassing restrictions and whatever else interesting or educational advice that can be given.

Thanks for any help or advice!

 

[BigAl07]

We are "Contracted" by LE/FD/EMS here in our county.

I'm not sure what you mean by Bypassing Restrictions. When flying for a public entity that's pretty much the LAST thing you want to do because quite possibly you'll have MORE restrictions. You'll want to get with the municipality and have their attorney determine what you can and can NOT do in support of LE. While it seems like a no brainer it's far from it. You have to abide by all local, county and State laws governing surveillance, evidence gathering, and chain of custody (means you might have to turn over your SD cards at the termination of the mission so plan ahead and have extras).

Ideally you would want to work with them and be granted a Public Use COA. If flying for the entity and once you have the COA you have more flexibility but it's a total pain in the tailfin to get that established because it requires attorneys and state officials to be involved.

Lastly make sure you understand you're putting your own self and equipment in danger and if it goes down can you/your business afford to buy another? The Municipality probably isn't in a position to buy drone (tax payers hear about it and they freak out!!) so it's going to be squarely on your shoulders. Make sure you can afford the risk.

 

[tcope]

You'd need to obtain UAS certification under Part 107 for non-hobby flight:

Fact Sheet – Small Unmanned Aircraft Regulations (Part 107)

 

[lpmccormick]

We are "Contracted" by LE/FD/EMS here in our county.

I'm not sure what you mean by Bypassing Restrictions. When flying for a public entity that's pretty much the LAST thing you want to do because quite possibly you'll have MORE restrictions. You'll want to get with the municipality and have their attorney determine what you can and can NOT do in support of LE. While it seems like a no brainer it's far from it. You have to abide by all local, county and State laws governing surveillance, evidence gathering, and chain of custody (means you might have to turn over your SD cards at the termination of the mission so plan ahead and have extras).

Ideally you would want to work with them and be granted a Public Use COA. If flying for the entity and once you have the COA you have more flexibility but it's a total pain in the tailfin to get that established because it requires attorneys and state officials to be involved.

Lastly make sure you understand you're putting your own self and equipment in danger and if it goes down can you/your business afford to buy another? The Municipality probably isn't in a position to buy drone (tax payers hear about it and they freak out!!) so it's going to be squarely on your shoulders. Make sure you can afford the risk.

I have no concerns about the danger of the equipment. The city and our police department are aware and willing to take care of anything that were to possibly go wrong. When I said I was looking bypass restrictions I guess what I was really asking is how do I need to go about gaining a COA for say night flights after civil twilight. I am hoping to have a meeting with all the department heads, as my services has been offered up to all areas of the city, and further investigate the laws and what we need to do to legally perform the operations in a safe, legal, and beneficial way to all or any persons who are involved.

 

[Southern Style]

I am in Law Enforcement and am currently flying for my department in Florida. Unfortunately, as you stated, the city attorney is in and out of our policy and procedures all the time. Not worried nearly about crashing the drone, that's small potatoes... but where and who it could crash into is their primary concern. Its great if they allow you to fly for them on your time, as long as you are not "compensated". Unfortunately, they look at it as we don't sell the photos or videos, but as the attorney stated, I am on the clock while flying, so there is my "compensation while flying".. So, I went and got the Part 107 license to fly and had to fill out the lengthy COA request. Had several other agencies (outside Florida) send me theirs so we had an idea on how in depth it actually is requesting nighttime operation, flying over people, within 5 miles of airport, requesting to fly farther than VLOS, etc.... Sounds a lot easier if you, as a civilian, can do it, without compensation.. but our agency wanted it done internally should we have an active shooter, or dangerous situation where it would be necessary to have an LEO within the Crime Scene. Especially for courtroom testimony..

 

[lpmccormick]

I am in Law Enforcement and am currently flying for my department in Florida. Unfortunately, as you stated, the city attorney is in and out of our policy and procedures all the time. Not worried nearly about crashing the drone, that's small potatoes... but where and who it could crash into is their primary concern. Its great if they allow you to fly for them on your time, as long as you are not "compensated". Unfortunately, they look at it as we don't sell the photos or videos, but as the attorney stated, I am on the clock while flying, so there is my "compensation while flying".. So, I went and got the Part 107 license to fly and had to fill out the lengthy COA request. Had several other agencies (outside Florida) send me theirs so we had an idea on how in depth it actually is requesting nighttime operation, flying over people, within 5 miles of airport, requesting to fly farther than VLOS, etc.... Sounds a lot easier if you, as a civilian, can do it, without compensation.. but our agency wanted it done internally should we have an active shooter, or dangerous situation where it would be necessary to have an LEO within the Crime Scene. Especially for courtroom testimony..

I would be compensated as I work for the city in the service department. So anything during day time hours I would obviously be on the clock as well as if I had to come in outside of normal working hours. I know that the police department is doing their part in seeing that the compensation would come out of their funds if they were to request me to come in, in the case of i.e. active shooter, crash scenes, or whatever may better serve them. I have had some small discussion with the police chief as far as making sure anything I would do for them be properly documented since anything I do to aid them could be used as evidence in court.

How difficult was it for you obtain a COA for night flights, flying with the mile radius of airport, and VLOS? Those circumstances seem to be the most obvious of situations that would occur.

 

[BigAl07]

It doesn't matter if you're "Compensated" or not. Hobbyist can not fly "for" any entity period.

In the USA if you are flying a UAS you have 3 options given to us by the FAA/Congress:
* Public COA (does not require Part 107 but that's a whole other ballgame)
* Part 101 (Hobby/recreational)
* Part 107 Civil Operations (Commercial, SAR, etc)

This is an exert from another topic of similar interest (this is for someone reading this to give the correct UAS operations):

Ok I got some clarification. It seems some of the problem stems from our own misunderstanding of the regs and how they were intended. Part 107 does not mean strictly "Commercial Operations" even though everyone (even the FAA) associates Part 107 with Commercial Use. It's even noted as the "Commercial UAS Rules" by the FAA. Commercial Operations are but one portion of what Part 107 encompasses.

Part 107 technically "allows" for "civil" UAS operations. Part of that "civil" operation can certainly be commercial operations but doesn't exclude other flights that are not "Commercial". Therefore, if you are not in compliance with Part 101 and you're not on an Exemption or Public Use COA, you are operating as a civil UAS and Part 107 applies.

Here is a direct quote from him:

"Think of it this way: Everyone is a civil UAS operator, subject to Part 107 (Public Use excluded). Now, Congress mandated that certain operators be left alone (not subject to Part 107) if they are operating as a hobbyist and codified law to describe what a hobbyist operation must adhere to. The FAA took that law and regurgitated it into Part 101. So, if you're going to claim that you are NOT flying under Part 107, you must follow all of Part 101, or else you revert back to Part 107 regulations."


So with that guidance directly from our FAA Liaison I think it's pretty clear (at least from my stand point which may be slightly skewed) that you must fit completely inside the Hobby/Recreational (Part 101) box or you do indeed default back to Part 107 regulations.

 

[rladwig]

I have no concerns about the danger of the equipment. The city and our police department are aware and willing to take care of anything that were to possibly go wrong. When I said I was looking bypass restrictions I guess what I was really asking is how do I need to go about gaining a COA for say night flights after civil twilight. I am hoping to have a meeting with all the department heads, as my services has been offered up to all areas of the city, and further investigate the laws and what we need to do to legally perform the operations in a safe, legal, and beneficial way to all or any persons who are involved.

Go onto the faa website and file for a night time waiver. You will have to come up with several ways to show the faa that you can do this safely. I use to work with my department until our city attorney and insurance company put a stop due to liability concerns. Make sure you get everything in writing from the agency as to what they will cover. Best of luck

 

[Southern Style]

As normal, every attorney would give you a different answer LOL... But I have to follow ours, so I got the 107 certificate.. As far as the COA, It was extremely in depth. I mean maps of the entire city, geography demographics, airport maps, citizen numbers, reason for flights, names, registration numbers, etc... Took us about 2 weeks before we were not getting ERROR messages because something was filled out incorrectly or missing information.. and of course, this was handling calls in between working on the COA..

Good to know BigAl.. thanks for all the info.. and again, I am just following our attorney as they will be the ones answering the hard queations.. lol..

 

[BigAl07]

Go onto the faa website and file for a night time waiver. You will have to come up with several ways to show the faa that you can do this safely. I use to work with my department until our city attorney and insurance company put a stop due to liability concerns. Make sure you get everything in writing from the agency as to what they will cover. Best of luck

This only applies if the OP is flying under Part 107.

 

[rladwig]

This only applies if the OP is flying under Part 107.

True if he is part 107 which I thought he said he was. Sorry if I missed that.

 

[Mike2A]

Part 107 Cert., I have done contracts for LE & Private security work.

 

[BigAl07]

True if he is part 107 which I thought he said he was. Sorry if I missed that.

I think you're right. I completely over looked the OP's very first comment:

I am a newly certified pilot for a municipality

My bad. Completely my mistake.

Carry on

 

[Southern Style]

Great information everyone.. a lot of threads relating to commercial "Real Estate & Survey Operations", but not many like this one... Good to hear a LEO thread. Unfortunately, I have had phone calls from several agencies within Florida, after seeing our news segment, who have actually told me "We have one, we just fly it when we need to"... And that scares me.. Thinking about all the negative publicity they might encounter, the defense attorneys that will have the photos/video, OR WORSE, evidence thrown out because they did not obtain them by following rules/regulations that are in place, etc.. I know this DRONE thing is growing, and growing FAST, and not all the rules are in place (as most of them will probably change from what they are now), but hopefully they will settle down and allow LEO to utilize the DRONE for purposes that will assist in documentation of evidence items and most importantly life threatening situations (active shooter, hostage situations, missing/endangered, etc..) I could tell you about a 4 hour shooting where over 300 rounds were fired by our agency and the Sheriff's Dept where the DRONE could have made things so much safer!! Officers putting themselves in danger over and over, where the DRONE could have done all that and nobody would have gotten hurt.

 

[Pdxdronepilot]

I'm a detective with an agency in Oregon. We are in process of getting our jurisdictional COA at the moment. Most of my city is in Class D airspace and we want to fly at night as well. Just got our blanket class G COA, which was a cinch. I'm part 107 certified and to this date have only conducted training missions. We wrote our policy so remote pilots and camera operators (dual control) are each part 107 certified as kind of a gate keeper. Per Oregon law, I can only fly an sUAS without a warrant for crime scene reconstruction, exigent circumstances, training, and search and rescue. Any evidence collected while conducting a training mission is not admissible in court. With that said, there is a lot of opportunities for use of a sUAS in police work, but I'm wanting to be very careful with our applications so as to not be THAT GUY that ruins it for the rest of us or for air support units as well. I've talked with several real pilots (I'm not a real pilot... ) and they have said they are concerned about the potential for mishaps and making case law, which I totally understand. So it's important to follow not only State and local, but also FAA regulations to not spoil it for the LEO community. I foresee the use of these things becoming a near everyday occurrence in the future, just need to put the public at ease that we are not just Willy Nilly spying on anyone and everyone with them. Just not the reality.

 

[drone636]

I am a newly certified pilot for a municipality. The police department here has requested to use me at their convenience. I am just curious if anyone out there is doing anything similar and how they have gone about their operations, as far as what all they have done, bypassing restrictions and whatever else interesting or educational advice that can be given.

Thanks for any help or advice!

I have been in law enforcement for ten years mostly as a k9 officer. I have been flying many aircraft for a few years and could not disagree more with a police department having use of drones in the United States. They have made it illegal in my state for law enforcement to use any type of UAV even for crime scene pics which I agree with. When we proposed it he'll broke out by the public when they found out about us wanting to use a "drone" good luck but bad idea in my opinion I'll bet my next check it lasts less than 10 flights until someone at a council meeting raises hell and they shut the program down.

 

[Dan Peters]

We are "Contracted" by LE/FD/EMS here in our county.

I'm not sure what you mean by Bypassing Restrictions. When flying for a public entity that's pretty much the LAST thing you want to do because quite possibly you'll have MORE restrictions. You'll want to get with the municipality and have their attorney determine what you can and can NOT do in support of LE. While it seems like a no brainer it's far from it. You have to abide by all local, county and State laws governing surveillance, evidence gathering, and chain of custody (means you might have to turn over your SD cards at the termination of the mission so plan ahead and have extras).

Ideally you would want to work with them and be granted a Public Use COA. If flying for the entity and once you have the COA you have more flexibility but it's a total pain in the tailfin to get that established because it requires attorneys and state officials to be involved.

Lastly make sure you understand you're putting your own self and equipment in danger and if it goes down can you/your business afford to buy another? The Municipality probably isn't in a position to buy drone (tax payers hear about it and they freak out!!) so it's going to be squarely on your shoulders. Make sure you can afford the risk.

This is great advice!!! Follow it and you should be okay

 

[Southern Style]

I have been in law enforcement for ten years mostly as a k9 officer. I have been flying many aircraft for a few years and could not disagree more with a police department having use of drones in the United States. They have made it illegal in my state for law enforcement to use any type of UAV even for crime scene pics which I agree with. When we proposed it he'll broke out by the public when they found out about us wanting to use a "drone" good luck but bad idea in my opinion I'll bet my next check it lasts less than 10 flights until someone at a council meeting raises hell and they shut the program down.

Sorry to hear of the controversy... We actually got full approval from our city council after our city attorneys approved the policy and procedure... Will see where we go from here.. Who knows... but I hope for the best..

 

[Pdxdronepilot]

Sorry to hear of the controversy... We actually got full approval from our city council after our city attorneys approved the policy and procedure... Will see where we go from here.. Who knows... but I hope for the best..

We did as well. No fuss from our city council and our chief and city attorney were on board and all want to come out to watch sometime.

 

[Southern Style]

We did as well. No fuss from our city council and our chief and city attorney were on board and all want to come out to watch sometime.

GREAT TO HEAR... When I had the Command Post running the live feed, the Fire Department was interested in utilizing it when we had large scale woods fires.. To see how close to residential neighborhoods and how fast it was travelling..