Phantom 1.1.1 with P2V props - Gain adjustment?

[havasuphoto]

Hello, I am new to here,

I fitted vision props today to my Phantom V.1.1.1

Wow nice running, quite quick too,
A bit noisy though, going to bug my neighbours, lol.

My concern is it doesn't hover as sweet as it did on original props, that being a problem when setting up for still pictures,

it want to oscillate about in a small circle, still stays pointed in the forward position though ?

what to do,

some say adjust the gains, but not sure how or to what setting.

never touched it insides or mind before, I am not a Brain Surgeon either lol

I can only see stuff for phantom 2 ?

any help out there ? PLEASE ?

It's explained in some of the earlier posts. Basically, you need to turn off you Gimbal(assuming you have one), and use the remote controls Tilt Lever, as X1.
You can test this by moving the tilt lever to the middle. Then, hook up your Phantom to the computer, remote on, power up the phantom.
Go to Gains page, select Basic Pitch and Roll, there will be a box that says INH-select that, and chose X1-you may need to push "enter" on the computer-not sure.
Now move your tilt switch slowly, and see if the gain values change.

If they do, then that's how you want to adjust all the gain values. Turn Basic Pitch and Roll back to INH and the default, and start with basic Attitude, change from INH to X1(make sure the tilt lever is centered), move the tilt lever slowly to see if it changes the values. If it does, good....center it at 100%(default).

Now go fly, in GPS mode, and move the tilt lever slowly up and down until you find a setting you like. Don't spend a lot of time on Basic Attitude(I left mine at 100).
Go back to your laptop/computer, and see what the number is under the setting you just changed. Change that from X1 to INH, and you're done with that axis.

Next, do Basic Pitch and Roll together-change from INH to X1, move the tilt lever to see if it's changes, center it at 125%, go fly.
You should see your wobble start to disappear while moving the tilt switch. It may be higher gains values or lower.....
When you find a setting that looks right, fly around a bit, and if your happy with that-go back and hook the aircraft up to the computer, look at that gain value, and change both to INH-done.

Last is Yaw...

Also-the very first step should always be to calibrate your remote, and calibrate you X1(tilt lever)channel.

Before you start, also save your Default values, and name them with the date....say something like 02142014....that way, you can always just load the default values if you go back to stock props.
Same for the vision props-once you have those gain values dialed in, save that file, and name is Vision Default, or whatever you wish.

 

[ElGuano]

Typically you don't need to disable your gimbal tilt, setting gains to x1 in Naza assistant will override the gimbal function, and return it automatically when you set back to inhibited.

 

[OI Photography]

crashmaniac, have you already installed the NAZA Assistant software for the P1 and connected the Phantom to it via USB cable?

 

[crashmaniac]

no mate,

just been flying it straight out off the box,

abit afraid of touching anything in case I stuff it up.

I did however download an assistant marked PT2 to my mac from DJI site,

but as mine is a Phantom V 1.1.1 l haven't tried it ?

ls there a specific assistant for a Phanton V 1.1.1 ? if so where can I find that, looks like only the latest PT2 is available, on DJI site,

l maybe wrong but ?

 

[OI Photography]

no mate,

just been flying it straight out off the box,

abit afraid of touching anything in case I stuff it up.

I did however download an assistant marked PT2 to my mac from DJI site,

but as mine is a Phantom V 1.1.1 l haven't tried it ?

ls there a specific assistant for a Phanton V 1.1.1 ? if so where can I find that, looks like only the latest PT2 is available, on DJI site,

l maybe wrong but ?

Ok, even aside from the gain settings (which you might not want to jump in to straight off the bat), it's important to get familiar with the NAZA Assistant software, and at the very least update the firmware on the Phantom if it didn't have the latest version on it when you got it.

Here's the page where you can download the things you need for this: http://www.dji.com/download/phantom-downloads/

From that page, you need at least the following:
-Phantom Quick Start Manual v1.7
-Phantom Advanced Manual v1.4
-Naza-M Assistant Software v2.20
-DJI Driver Installer

However, before doing anything beyond reading the manuals, I highly suggest you watch what we call "Colin's Videos"...a great series of instructional vids for new Phantom pilots like yourself that cover all the basics such has how to use the Assistant software, and other key concepts. They used to be on DJI's site, but were removed due to legal turmoil that I won't bother to get in to right now. However, they've been saved and re-posted by a few people, but I don't know where offhand. I'm sure one of the others in this thread will know where they can be found now.

Once you watch those, you'll understand the functions of the Phantom and the software, and you should be able to handle the rest from there.

ElG/havasu/et al...anybody have current links for those?

 

[mediaguru]

havasu:

Can I take this reader's digest version of your settings?

Pitch 220%
Roll 220%
Yaw 175%
Att 100%

 

[havasuphoto]

Yep...try them.
It may not be the ideal settings for your set-up...but, I'm thinking your wobble may go away, or not be as bad.

Do you have the ability to map the X1(tilt) channel to something on your remote that's variable? I know you have the CM3000....which switch are you using to pan/tilt with?

Or, you can do it the "old fashioned" way....laptop, field, phantom, and cable/remote. Start with just 1 axis, and raise or lower 10% at a time, fly, and try again......

I don't think you'll have any surprises with my gain settings. If flies good......and from what I've seen, the gains are pretty forgiving. Just remember to keep flying the aircraft. If it starts to wobble, it's still controllable.
Most important thing to remember with vision props; descend, very, very slowly, and always try to fly forward, into the wind, while descending.

 

[mediaguru]

Yep...try them.
It may not be the ideal settings for your set-up...but, I'm thinking your wobble may go away, or not be as bad.

Do you have the ability to map the X1(tilt) channel to something on your remote that's variable? I know you have the CM3000....which switch are you using to pan/tilt with?

Or, you can do it the "old fashioned" way....laptop, field, phantom, and cable/remote. Start with just 1 axis, and raise or lower 10% at a time, fly, and try again......

I don't think you'll have any surprises with my gain settings. If flies good......and from what I've seen, the gains are pretty forgiving. Just remember to keep flying the aircraft. If it starts to wobble, it's still controllable.
Most important thing to remember with vision props; descend, very, very slowly, and always try to fly forward, into the wind, while descending.

Funny you mentioned that. I JUST got the tilt lever yesterday. I was hoping to get it installed this weekend.

I'm going to flash the bird with those new settings shortly and see if the wind is mild enough for a test.

 

[havasuphoto]

You should be fine with those settings.
Just realize that he aircraft may correct more quickly, by itself, in the wind.

 

[mediaguru]

Just did one flight so far. Seems a little too jumpy and I could definitely see some wobble in the frame and gear.

I may change the gear to the bigger setup, which hangs a bit lower. Didn't have any wobbles with that setup. Maybe a little more weight and lower CG will help. I'll leave the settings for that flight.

Also what's your diagnosis on this? After a while of hovering in a mild wind the bird seems ok. If I try to rotate on its axis, it drifts big time. We're talking 10-20 feet before I had to stop it. I may have to fly it inside to be sure if it rotates properly.

 

[havasuphoto]

I don't know why it would drift?
My testing was all done fully loaded. So, if you took stuff off, it may be too sensitive or too much gain...
the best way to do this is adjusting the individual gains with the tilt lever-as described a few pages back. And, if you have a big enough space indoors, and can get GPS-that would be great.
I believe you can still do the adjustments in Attitude mode....shouldn't be any different, except you'll need to hold position.

 

[mediaguru]

There was some wind so hard to say how much was the wind. I do have a tall ceiling so I'll have to do some test hovering inside to be sure.

Right now I'm having trouble finding the correct way to wire up the gimbal with the naza.

 

[havasuphoto]

You have the CM3000? I thought it was self-powered? I guess what I'm saying is I thought it only had to be powered by the aircrafts battery, and didn't receiver signals through Naza-thought it has it's own internal something or other......??

when I first did my gains, the winds was up to around 10mph, and I had to stop.....I ended up at that time with 230 for pitch, roll, and yaw, with 100 attitude.
I tamed the p/r down a bit after flying with now wind, and also found the yaw a bit too fast for my liking at 230 so I went down to 175.

What issues are you having the the Gimbal?

 

[mediaguru]

Yes all the CM3000 "needs" to function out of the box is power. In that capacity it has been fantastic. I've been running it via the Phantom's aux power cable.

BUT, I'm setting up the camera tilt so I can rotate the camera angle from horizontal to parallel to the ground, via the hidden channel on the Phantom TX.

 

[havasuphoto]

Fedex arrived at 8am this morning, with my Phantom!!!! Un-boxed, and just spun the DJI Vision props on, and went for a few flights.
Just hovered around a bit-chases some dogs, the usual. got 9:15 flight time out of a Maddog battery before 1st level warning.

But, I still have this wobble; it's most noticeable when a slight breeze blows. And, even after inserting ear plugs into the black rubber dampers on my Zen, I still have a wobble and bounce in my video.
So, I've taken the ear plugs back out. I'm totally lost now on what to do next, to fix this, OR, is this just a permanent issue with a junk Chinese Gimbal?

@El Guano; IF, I adjust my Basic Attitude Gain value from 100 down to 60, what should I expect, flight control wise?

that's the only other thing I haven't tried yet. So, looks like I have to go back down the street to the park, and mess with gains.....
Also, I've thought of just zip tying my 2 lateral Dampers-so they would barely move....does anyone think that will help?

Because right now-most of my footage is useless without the use of post processing stabilization(looks really good then)...and I'm trying to avoid that extra step(costs $$).

FYI, the DJI Vision props spun right on, down to the square notch, where they stop. They showed no tendency to loosen in flight, and I put the aircraft through some pretty sporty maneuvers. They also appear to be balanced enough that I didn't notice any issues there.
I did find my Big Battery Door had come open-while using a stock battery. So, I'll be sure to add some cushioning material in there, and a piece of "safety tape", just to be on the safe side. never had that happen before-and I'll make sure it never happens again.

 

[ElGuano]

Fedex arrived at 8am this morning, with my Phantom!!!! Un-boxed, and just spun the DJI Vision props on, and went for a few flights.
Just hovered around a bit-chases some dogs, the usual. got 9:15 flight time out of a Maddog battery before 1st level warning.

But, I still have this wobble; it's most noticeable when a slight breeze blows. And, even after inserting ear plugs into the black rubber dampers on my Zen, I still have a wobble and bounce in my video.
So, I've taken the ear plugs back out. I'm totally lost now on what to do next, to fix this, OR, is this just a permanent issue with a junk Chinese Gimbal?

@El Guano; IF, I adjust my Basic Attitude Gain value from 100 down to 60, what should I expect, flight control wise?

that's the only other thing I haven't tried yet. So, looks like I have to go back down the street to the park, and mess with gains.....
Also, I've thought of just zip tying my 2 lateral Dampers-so they would barely move....does anyone think that will help?

Because right now-most of my footage is useless without the use of post processing stabilization(looks really good then)...and I'm trying to avoid that extra step(costs $$).

FYI, the DJI Vision props spun right on, down to the square notch, where they stop. They showed no tendency to loosen in flight, and I put the aircraft through some pretty sporty maneuvers. They also appear to be balanced enough that I didn't notice any issues there.
I did find my Big Battery Door had come open-while using a stock battery. So, I'll be sure to add some cushioning material in there, and a piece of "safety tape", just to be on the safe side. never had that happen before-and I'll make sure it never happens again.

Wait, you got another Phantom? Did I miss something (hopefully not a big crash)? Either way, congrats!

As to the gain question, I'm not sure what you mean. Basic and attitude gains are separate, there's no "basic attitude" gains, though there should be because the naming is a ridiculous misnomer....but that ends up creating confusion just like this...

 

[havasuphoto]

I sent my Phantom away to have an engine replacement-got it back Today.
The setting is Basic Vertical. I have it now set to 80%.
The Attitude setting is only for Pitch and Roll-both are set at 100%.
Went back to Basic P/R 230%, Yaw 180%, Vertical 80%. This is with the Stock DJI Vision props, w/nuts.

I think the change in Vertical down to 80% did nothing-as I just watched the video of when I was turning that gain, and saw no appreciable change-I still have a vertical "hop" in my video, in all phases of flight, with the Zen, black balls, and no ear plugs in the balls.
I'm thinking of going back to the 8" stock props and gains, to see what I have there. Because right now-this isn't working for me.
I get great flight times...but the video looks bad.

EDIT: I've changed the gains back to where they were before; P/R 220%, Yaw 175% and Vertical 100%. Just saw some things in the video I didn't like.
Tomorrow, I'll try my bolt on, knock-off vision props...and see what I get. I'm also going to put the 8" props back on, reset the gains to stock, and see how the video looks.

It's very difficult to see the vertical hop through FPV....so usually I have to go home and watch the GP3 footage.

Also, by reading the instructions, I see that Attitude Pitch/Roll(set at 100% now), is only used for sensitivity of the control sticks.
I can't imagine a change in that would get rid of my vertical hop.

 

[dbcch]

In theory, the [near] ideal settings for CW/CCW P2V props on their P1's should be the same for everyone. After all, the manufacturer ships with defaults that work for everyone.

So, I don't see the need to go discover these settings.

We need an exact recommendation for new settings.

EDIT: My prior settings went too low, in some area or another, making the take-off tend to cause it to just lean forward and crash.

 

[havasuphoto]

In theory, the [near] ideal settings for CW/CCW P2V props on their P1's should be the same for everyone. After all, the manufacturer ships with defaults that work for everyone.

So, I don't see the need to go discover these settings.

We need an exact recommendation for new settings.

EDIT: My prior settings went too low, in some area or another, making the take-off tend to cause it to just lean forward and crash.

The Naza-M controller is just a "container". We don't know the exact values that DJI put in there for the PV2. Even though the gain values may be the same...we don't know the "base" value-on either aircraft.
So, they could have started at what would be 200%, on a P1/2, but in the gain values, it shows at 125%.

That's what makes this so difficult. Naza is just a controller, used on a lot of aircraft-and each aircraft has a different "program". So, you can't extrapolate values from 1 aircraft to the next.

As for your low gain values, I'm pretty sure you saw quite a bit of wobble with those too? Most Phantoms with Zen and Go Pro require some aft stick on take off. Just rise up on the throttle slow-and fly the aircraft. If it starts to lurch forward, reduce the throttle, apply more aft stick, and slowly raise the throttle. Don't rush your take-off.

 

[dbcch]

The Naza-M controller is just a "container". We don't know the exact values that DJI put in there for the PV2. Even though the gain values may be the same...we don't know the "base" value-on either aircraft.
So, they could have started at what would be 200%, on a P1/2, but in the gain values, it shows at 125%.

Hmm, well I see why the unknown 'base' values would cause issues with exact comparison and computation between the P1 and P2V, but I don't see why that prevents us from all ending up with the same user-set gains, as shown in the assistant software. There will be some variance, but there should be a set of user settings that 'just work' with these props.