Night Flights

[Airborne]

My point was that if you can see it so can others, and busy bodies are more apt to report a 'UFO' buzzing around at night.

UFO's are a thing of the past...

now it's just drones...

 

[F6Rider]

UFO's are a thing of the past...

now it's just drones...

Nope, still around....
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...2ede4b0b23e3ce2b8c9?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000592

 

[Airborne]

Nope, still around....
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...2ede4b0b23e3ce2b8c9?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000592

it's drones i tell ya....

 

[Youngbill]

Wildwood, NJ 4th of July!!

Was that this year? Did you happen to see the other drone flying closer to the fire works? I was watching from the beach at about Spencer Ave and definitely saw one really close. I was wondering if he was filming with the fireworks crew.

BTW: We have a house in the Crest. My first few flights with the P3P -

 

[dirkclod]

Was that this year?

Hey Bill..Ohh Billll

Look at the top of the video and it tells ya
Yes it was and just messing with ya

 

[Youngbill]

Sorry, it's late

 

[GoodnNuff]

Night flying is great. I have extra LEDs on my Phantom 1 just for night flights.

But yes, scope out your flight path during the day just to make sure there are no obstructions like power lines or trees.
The Inspire that was caught in power lines over a 100 feet above Lake Union here in Seattle this spring was most likely flying at night. It cost nearly $35,000 to retrieve and repair the damage - not sure if they found the owner (or if he had his contact info on the Inspire).

 

[SteveMann]

We are not operating model aircraft. We are operating unmanned aircraft. There is a big difference in the eyes of the FAA. I am a professional pilot with almost 10,000 hrs of flight time. I am also a certified flight instructor and am very familiar with the FAA rules and regulations, and the proposed regulations. I am in the process of registering my P3 with the FAA for commercial use. People not using common sense with unmanned aircraft are causing more rules and restrictions to be placed on us. One guy last his drone in a hot pool in Yellowstone last year--that led to us not being able to fly in National parks. Most regulations are reactive to things that people have done in the past.

Then you don't know how FAA rules are made, do you? The current FAA rules do not differentiate from hobby aircraft or personal drones and there are no FAA rules against night flying.

 

[SteveMann]

After reading the faa interpretation of LOS even a spotter does not count. Goggles are technically a violation as they block your unaided track on the vehicle. Seems like no matter what there is a rule that could get you busted.

Guidelines - not rules. There is no rule to violate.

 

[Deleted member 29014]

Guidelines - not rules. There is no rule to violate.

ok, now guide me down the rabbit hole...
If the FAA considers UAVs aircraft, then follows that when flying at night they must display position lights as required in F.A.R.s 91.209 and 27.1387. Am I wrong?

 

[snerd]

ok, now guide me down the rabbit hole...
If the FAA considers UAVs aircraft, then follows that when flying at night they must display position lights as required in F.A.R.s 91.209 and 27.1387. Am I wrong?

It's a strange position they (FAA) find themselves in. They say they're aircraft when it comes to control of the airspace, but when some clod gets offended and destroys one, they (FAA) say it's a matter for the "local" authorities. Talking out both sides of their mouth. I'll be glad when they finalize the rules and there is no more bickering here about it!

 

[Deleted member 29014]

It's a strange position they (FAA) find themselves in. They say they're aircraft when it comes to control of the airspace, but when some clod gets offended and destroys one, they (FAA) say it's a matter for the "local" authorities. Talking out both sides of their mouth. I'll be glad when they finalize the rules and there is no more bickering here about it!

I didn't see any bickering in my post it's a discussion between adults. Don't have to read it.

 

[snerd]

I didn't see any bickering in my post it's a discussion between adults. Don't have to read it.

I meant bickering in a "general" sense, not your post in particular.

 

[Deleted member 29014]

I meant bickering in a "general" sense, not your post in particular.

At any rate, the same discussions are, no doubt, ongoing at FAA HQ. As many of us have stated, the FAA is coming from behind attempting to get in front of the civilian UAV issue. They will sort it all out, in time. Also keep in mind the FAA is a pilot's agency, run by pilots, so expect any new rules to be drafted within that context. Of course, just my opinion, and I could be wrong.

 

[snerd]

At any rate, the same discussions are, no doubt, ongoing at FAA HQ. As many of us have stated, the FAA is coming from behind attempting to get in front of the civilian UAV issue. They will sort it all out, in time. Also keep in mind the FAA is a pilot's agency, run by pilots, so expect any new rules to be drafted within that context. Of course, just my opinion, and I could be wrong.

No, I believe you're right. Except that they will remain the same recommendations for us hobby and recreational flyers, with maybe some extra threats thrown in!

 

[SteveMann]

ok, now guide me down the rabbit hole...
If the FAA considers UAVs aircraft, then follows that when flying at night they must display position lights as required in F.A.R.s 91.209 and 27.1387. Am I wrong?

No. But the NTSB said that model aircraft were aircraft only for the enforcement of 91.13 Careless and Reckless. Position lights are required for certified aircraft, but the FAA has already said that these small UAS do not require airworthiness certification.

It will be interesting to see what we get in the Part 107 rules as some of the commenters had something to say with a blanket "no night flight" rule. In my comment I said that night flight should be allowed if the UAS had position lights visible for at least three miles as seen from above. Same requirement for parachute flight at night.

14 CFR §105.19 Parachute operations between sunset and sunrise.
(a) No person may conduct a parachute operation, and no pilot in command of an aircraft may allow a person to conduct a parachute operation from an aircraft between sunset and sunrise, unless the person or object descending from the aircraft displays a light that is visible for at least 3 statute miles.

(b) The light required by paragraph (a) of this section must be displayed from the time that the person or object is under a properly functioning open parachute until that person or object reaches the surface.
​

I guess that a dark free-fall is OK?

 

[Deleted member 29014]

No. But the NTSB said that model aircraft were aircraft only for the enforcement of 91.13 Careless and Reckless. Position lights are required for certified aircraft, but the FAA has already said that these small UAS do not require airworthiness certification.

It will be interesting to see what we get in the Part 107 rules as some of the commenters had something to say with a blanket "no night flight" rule. In my comment I said that night flight should be allowed if the UAS had position lights visible for at least three miles as seen from above. Same requirement for parachute flight at night.

14 CFR §105.19 Parachute operations between sunset and sunrise.
(a) No person may conduct a parachute operation, and no pilot in command of an aircraft may allow a person to conduct a parachute operation from an aircraft between sunset and sunrise, unless the person or object descending from the aircraft displays a light that is visible for at least 3 statute miles.

(b) The light required by paragraph (a) of this section must be displayed from the time that the person or object is under a properly functioning open parachute until that person or object reaches the surface.
​

I guess that a dark free-fall is OK?

But they make such a nasty splat on the windshield. This discussion is what I mean by the rabbit hole of FARs, NTSB'S interpretation, UAVs and common sense. Hopefully the brain thrust at 800 Independence Ave. in the Hollywood for Ugly People will sort it out.

 

[redmoe]

Guidelines - not rules. There is no rule to violate.

Agreed they are "guidelines" but it seems they have been going out of their way to scare folks into those guidelines. I was just throwing that out there as is seems that is the official interpretation of their guidelines. Also I could see these interpretations feeding into careless and reckless argument.

Other than the my spotter interpretation the guidelines are pretty good standards for safe flying.

 

[SteveMann]

Other than the my spotter interpretation the guidelines are pretty good standards for safe flying.

I never said they weren't. I always encourage people to fly safely and when practical, fly the guidelines. And at all times follow the rules.

 

[GoodnNuff]

I never said they weren't. I always encourage people to fly safely and when practical, fly the guidelines. And at all times follow the rules.

Funny, the majority of your posts I see are telling people there are no rules...