Lubrication

Hey Nigel,

I have one of the first Blade 350QX quads.

It has hundreds of flights. 2 years old and still going strong on the original motors.

Just a little light oiling occasionally.

These brushless motors can take a lot of use. With just a little maintenance & care, they should run for years


Absolutely .... having no brushes etc. they are excellent long term units - as long as power in / out is observed well !!

I have been known to put 4S through a Westor 4300kv 450 heli motor and a 5x5 prop on !! For the couple of flights it lasted - I hit my all time record speeds ... but sadly video failed and I could not claim it for WF. Speeds in excess of 260kph on a HK Parkjet.
I actually got my WF "Award" in the end for another same motor but 3S on 5x5 at 222kph ..... which lasted quite well !!
But they are another story ...

Nigel
 
One thing to avoid if blowing sand ... don't drive it further in especially blowing from front .... it drives it back of the windings onto the rear bearing area.

If blowing - then it really needs blowing in from the sides at rear.

Contact cleaner ? Only as a last resort as that leaves a very dry surface if pure cleaner - but some of them have residues which can be worst thing ever ...

The old trick when motors are more easily removed ... wash in fresh or distilled water..... by basically sloshing it around. Take out and shake dry ... let it air dry. Then a touch of light machine oil on the back bearing.

Nigel
 
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Sheilded bearings do have grease, the rolling elements must be seperated by a lubricant, this reduces friction and helps cool the bearing. The reason for sheilded bearings is that the rim spreed on lip seals (full contact) would generate heat and the friction would consume some power, heat = energy. In a shielded bearing the type of grease used is the seal, the load and speed determins the type of grease requirered to attain a suitable life. The life of sheilded bearings is finite and many variables will determine life expextations. If a bearing starts to scream the lubrication is failing, by adding oil you are only temporarily extending life. Once this process has started you will have to lube often as the original grease no longer does it's job of sealing and lubricating. Oil will not remain in the bearing for very long as the shields are non contact. Change the bearings and save yourself time and the risk of a catatrophic failure in flight.
 
An example of extended life ...

My throw in air anywhere anytime 3D machine has a 2836 1100KV BL motor up front ... it has a very hard life - far harder than a P3S !
It gets buried in snow, mud, into puddles, sand and grit.
It started to complain understandably more than a year ago ... in fact more like 2 years ago.
I give it a drop of light machine oil maybe once every few months or so ... that motor is still singing sweetly and I expect it to continue for another few years before I give it up. In fact I reckon it will outlive the model.

I have an EDF with 5000kv outrunner BL in it ... and I am really unkind to it .. I give it a 4S pack when max is a 3S. She screams her head off and she also gets her drop every so often ... more than 4 years and still going. She was already over a year old when this video made ..


Nigel
 
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Here's another idea - maybe use the air blower cans they sell for cleaning out keyboards? I wonder if there would be any problem with that? Curious....
 
Hey, Guys...
What do you think about to take off from hands?
Wouldn't it avoid dust into engines as well?
And so, preventing unecessary or excess of lubrication?
 
I find that lubrication for the pilot to be sufficient...after landing of course.

Another reason for the park table !

Nigel
 
I fly all sorts ... so forgive me for sidetracking the thread for a bit !!

My avatar at side has :

To left : Kyosho Pitts S2 with Irvine 53 Glow up front.
Centre : 40 year old Skymaster Display Biplane with ASP 61 Glow up front.
To right : Extra 300 with ASP 91FS up front.

Glowline-up002_zpse377fbf2.jpg
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Here's the old girl still flies today ...



Just a small selection of Sunday sport stuff ...



Here's another of my real favs .... Zlin Z50 (I have two .. one with 15cc Gasoline, other with 5055 Electric 6S system) :



I have a hangar of over 50 models ready to go ... includes flying boats / waterplanes, sport, 3D, aerobatic, biplanes, WW1, WW2, modern jets, Multi Rotors, Helis etc.

Its a serious hobby for me .... and has been since a small child in early 1960's.

Having fun on the river at back of my house ....


The 'gas' Zlin ..


Nigel
 
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And one to show I fly other "4 engine" babies .... my Avro Lancaster .....


Nigel
 
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Nice collection Nigel.


Cheers .... not same words as my Wife uses though !!

I'm waiting architects plans for a new building next to the house which will be my workshops and model den. Underneath will be a 3 car garage !!

Nigel
 
If it was important DJI would tell you ... and they don't.
Lots of people want to feel they are doing "something" but it's not necessarily helping at all.

I'm with you Meta4 - here is my 2 cents worth...........

The bearings in the Phantoms are "ZZ" type - that double "Z" indicates double shielded (shield on both sides). A sealed bearing is designated with "RS or 2RS" (single or double rubber seal).

IMO only. I am doubtful they would have a double seal on these bearings turning at the rpm they do - rs bearings would create far too much heat (shielded bearings provide 2 essential outcomes - 1 being the release of heat from the bearing and lubricant and the other to prevent loss of lubricant - somewhat). I had one guy tell me Phantom bearings have nylon races (that would explain somewhat as to self lubrication) - I for one am very doubtful they have nylon races however.

When someone posts there motors were noisy or felt rough turning by hand and that oil quieted them down or made them smoother - they are somewhat correct. However, don't be fooled by results since once you hear or feel a bearing, generally speaking it is a little too late and the damage has been done - oiling would then be a temporary fix only. Considering the cost involved I would say it is best to replace after hearing any noise emitting from them and especially so if the motors feel a little rough or have slight tight spots when rotated by hand.

I have never seen anything from DJI with regard to lubrication of the motor bearings - I have been flying both the P3A and P4 for a couple of years now without ever lubricating. My P3A does have one motor that feels a little rougher than the other 3 and will replace the bearing rather than get into oiling. Since one feels just a little rough I plan on replacing bearings on all 4 motors with ceramic type. Ceramic bearings are lighter, smoother contact running (especially for high speed) and the L10 (life) is much longer.

It's a matter of choice I suppose when it comes to oiling - I firmly believe once you begin oiling you will have to continue oiling. Lubricants are all different - start adding the incorrect oil to these bearings and you may be introducing a mismatch relative to the make up of the original lubricant. Detergent properties of one lubricant Vs another may cause a "washout" of the other lubricant - hence requiring the oiling process to be continued fairly regular. Constant and over oiling can produce issues relative to dirt cling and increased temperatures also.

Speaking of dirt clinging - the props do a sufficient job of keeping airborne contaminants away from the motors anyway without having to use compressed air to clean them. If you start using compressed air to blow contaminants off the motors due to oil reside - there remains a slight chance you could blow some crap into the bearing also.

Until the OEM tells me differently - I will continue to fly as is. Of course, I do check by hand turning motors prior to flight and monitoring temps after flight (trending) each and every time in order to have good relative information regarding the rolling elements for the motor and to have a safe bird in the sky.
 
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Oil is my business ... I blend and ship the stuff ...

I was blending and creating specific grades for various specific markets incl. EU and US ... that included Gasolines, Diesels, Lubricating and medium to heavy Fuel Oils.

My work is for major Oil Co's and Traders. I know what's in them ... I know what we use to treat and correct them.

When I suggest Light Machine Oil such as Sewing Machine Oil .... it is based on knowledge.

Its up to you guys ... really is ... me ? I run my motors till I have believe there is reason to give a drop of oil. All motors that I have decided to oil are still in use and most are years old. I don't have to keep oiling as some claim ... on average I may oil once or twice a year ....

Nigel
 
I have been lub'g my e-motors on all models for years and never had any trouble --- in fact it has reduced noise and increased smoothness.

For the Phantom - I undo the 4 screws, carefully lean the motor over with model inverted ... small 'teardrop' of very light Seeing Machine Oil on end of toothpick .... touch side of shaft end and then spin motor.
Put motor back ....

Man has been lubricating bicycles, karts, model engines, literally anything that spins, rotates and especially with bearings.

Phantom motors are actually quite hard working motors and its good to give them a bit of kindness once or twice a year.

About grit - that will get in regardless of any oil. If it gets into a 'dry' bearing that starts to heat up from friction ..... guess what.

The secret is to use SWO ...

Nigel

any chance of a photo of where to apply the sewing machine oil on the motor for those less knowledgable?
 

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