Phantom 4 Crash, DJI at fault?

[Method007]

Sorry to hear about your crash mate, I have been there!
I can relate to this issue with my own experience of this message "current RTH will pass a no-fly zone" that I got when not even close to a such zone. What happened to me is: I got that message, lost connection with aircraft, then aicraft started RTH but in the direction away from me! The original RTH point (where I was standing) was erased and new one appeared where the aircraft lost connection. At that point the craft was approx. 1,5km from me and flying away. Only my luck I could re-connect and stop RTH and bring it back manually.

Some people here on forum tend to read those flight rapports as they were holy bible, which they are not. They are probably as holy and accurate as DJI´s crappy firmware, support and customer service. Point is, listen to all the tips but dont let people tell you that everything was your fault.

Dude for the millionth time - the crash was your fault, get over it.

 

[Meta4]

I will post flight data on this described issue, it just got pointless at least for me to spend time on solving more issues.
Are you still surprised that unexpected issues and problems do happen with DJI drones?

We're still waiting to see the data ......

Are you still surprised that unexpected issues and problems do happen with DJI drones?

What surprises me is the few people that attempt to tell us that the recorded flight data isn't reliable.

Point a case were you can say with 100% accuracy that it was not DJI´s fault or of that flight report firing some wrong warnings?

By carefully reading the flight data to see the story it tells you can often see exactly what happened in a flight and sometimes it shows clearly that what really happened was very different from what the owner thought happened.

Why would you blindly believe in dji´s flight report?
How can you know the compass is 100% functional, GPS, electronics that control sticks? It is a same company that makes that "flight rapport maker" that makes drones.

That's like saying Why would you blindly believe Newton's 3 laws of motion?
I trust the recorded data because I've investigated many, many flight records including my own and I've seen how accurate they are.

Now it's your turn.
Come up with flight data or stop telling us what you believe happened.

 

[Tim Pearson]

I don't want to argue with anyone, but I would like to mention that the logging system saved my bacon and gave evidence that ultimately led to DJI repairing my drone for free.

The barometer readings went insanely low virtually instantaneously, making the drone think it was much higher than it was... as a result, it crashed into the ground at high speed, trying to correct for the ascent it thought it detected. The logs proved this... no stick inputs, full GPS lock, etc... the only thing out of line was the huge change in barometer from one poll to the next. I found this and pointed it out to DJI.

They did a full repair of my drone for free.

Perhaps (I don't know) it even led to some code modifications for the situation where GPS altitude and barometer altitude suddenly and dramatically diverge.

 

[JoeG729]

Your recollection may be incorrect, according to the flight data. It was descending slowly and moving towards the building, and attempted obstacle avoidance at 730 seconds. What does the video show? It kept moving very slowly the north east, possibly under the influence of the wind which was out of the south but probably doing strange things around the building, and then hit the building. There was only one impact, at 731.4 seconds, as seen on the pitch data.

View attachment 88346

View attachment 88347

It also appears that you did not use back elevator to attempt to avoid the building - the elevator and aileron are both centered and you had not applied either since the 700 second mark. You were applying throttle, both up and down in the last few seconds. Perhaps you were confused?

View attachment 88350

[/QUOTE]
Ssr104 How do you obtain this detailed telemetry data/graph ? I'm not finding such with air data or phantom log viewer.

 

[sar104]

Ssr104 How do you obtain this detailed telemetry data/graph ? I'm not finding such with air data or phantom log viewer.

From the PhantomHelp website, and from the AirData site if the user who uploaded the txt log enabled it in the sharing preferences, you can download a csv version of the flight log which contains far more information than the limited column display on PhantomHelp.

 

[pe9999]

when your quad is close to the wall, the prop wash may create vacuum between your quad and the wall which sucks your quad into the wall.

 

[JoeNewbe]

From the PhantomHelp website, and from the AirData site if the user who uploaded the txt log enabled it in the sharing preferences, you can download a csv version of the flight log which contains far more information than the limited column display on PhantomHelp.

Thanks

 

[JoeNewbe]

From the PhantomHelp website, and from the AirData site if the user who uploaded the txt log enabled it in the sharing preferences, you can download a csv version of the flight log which contains far more information than the limited column display on PhantomHelp.

Thanks for taking the time to answer. So if I understand I would upload the csv from the SD card as opposed to the tablet text file to observe a graph? Uploading the text file just produces the column info.

 

[sar104]

Thanks for taking the time to answer. So if I understand I would upload the csv from the SD card as opposed to the tablet text file to observe a graph? Uploading the text file just produces the column info.

No - this is just in reference to the mobile device txt file that you can upload to PhantomHelp or AirData. If you then download the resulting csv file from those sites you will find that it contains more data than the websites actually display.

For example, the csv generated by PhantomHelp contains the following:

'Time(seconds)'
'Id'
'Time(text)'
'Latitude'
'Longitude'
'FlightMode'
'Altitude(feet)'
'Altitude(meters)'
'VpsAltitude(feet)'
'VpsAltitude(meters)'
'Speed(mph)'
'Speed(m/s)'
'HomeDistance(feet)'
'HomeDistance(meters)'
'HomeLatitude'
'HomeLongitude'
'GpsCount'
'BatteryPower(%)'
'BatteryVoltage'
'BatteryVoltageDeviation'
'BatteryCell1Voltage'
'BatteryCell2Voltage'
'BatteryCell3Voltage'
'VelocityX'
'VelocityY'
'VelocityZ'
'Pitch'
'Roll'
'Yaw'
'RcAileron'
'RcElevator'
'RcGyro'
'RcRudder'
'RcThrottle'
'NonGpsError'
'GoHomeStatus'
'AppTip'
'AppWarning'
'AppMessage'

The AirData csv contains:

'time(millisecond)'
'latitude'
'longitude'
'altitude(feet)'
'ascent(feet)'
'speed(mph)'
'distance(feet)'
'datetime(utc)'
'satellites'
'voltage(v)'
'max_altitude(feet)'
'max_ascent(feet)'
'max_speed(mph)'
'max_distance(feet)'
'compass_heading(degrees)'
' pitch(degrees)'
' roll(degrees)'
'isPhoto'
'isVideo'
'rc_elevator'
'rc_aileron'
'rc_throttle'
'rc_rudder'
'gimbal_heading(degrees)'
'gimbal_pitch(degrees)'
'battery_percent'
'voltageCell1'
'voltageCell2'
'voltageCell3'
'battery_temperature(f)'
'flycStateRaw'
'flycState'
'message'

The files that you are referring to on the internal SD card are the DAT files. Those contain even more data types logged at shorter intervals.

 

[Theo450]

What purpose do you suppose the flight logs actually serve? They are automatically sent to DJI for the purposes of analyzing and improving the flight characteristics and performance of their aircraft. It is in DJI's best interest for them to be totally accurate.

95% of the crash incidents I have read about are obviously pilot error.

 

[Meta4]

What purpose do you suppose the flight logs actually serve? They are automatically sent to DJI for the purposes of analyzing and improving the flight characteristics and performance of their aircraft.

The flight data is not automatically sent to DJI.
They don't get to see your data unless you choose to synch your flight records and share them with DJI.

 

[Theo450]

The flight data is not automatically sent to DJI.
They don't get to see your data unless you choose to synch your flight records and share them with DJI.

In the terms of use that users must agree to, it states that flight telemetry data is automatically collected by DJI.

 

[Meta4]

In the terms of use that users must agree to, it states that flight telemetry data is automatically collected by DJI.

I suspect that is relating to the data being collected - and saved in the app and internal data recorder but it's not saying that the data gets automatically uploaded to DJI.

If ever you have an incident and contact DJI, the first thing they ask for is that you synch the flight data so they have access to it.
I know that my flight data is not automatically uploaded.
Like many other users, I fly a wifi only tablet far from any wifi.
DJI have no idea when or where I've flown unless I care to share that info.

 

[tevek]

In the terms of use that users must agree to, it states that flight telemetry data is automatically collected by DJI.

As @Meta4 has stated, you need to sync your flights for the data to be uploaded to the DJI server. Most of my flying (99%) is without either mobile or internet coverage and I shut down the app when finished, so it should be impossible for any data collection. Having said that when I had Litchi issues some time ago, they suggested that I switch my device to airplane mode to prevent telemetry data being sent back to DJI to prevent the corruption of my pano efforts. I emailed them back with the above mentioned 'no access to mobile and Internet' and they replied with ' must be a problem somewhere else'.

 

[Theo450]

I suspect that is relating to the data being collected - and saved in the app and internal data recorder but it's not saying that the data gets automatically uploaded to DJI.

If ever you have an incident and contact DJI, the first thing they ask for is that you synch the flight data so they have access to it.
I know that my flight data is not automatically uploaded.
Like many other users, I fly a wifi only tablet far from any wifi.
DJI have no idea when or where I've flown unless I care to share that info.

I apologize, it is in their Privacy Policy DJI Privacy Policy - Everything You Need To Know, not Terms of use. I just read it again. They collect a lot of data about your DJI and non DJI devices including flight record data.

 

[Meta4]

I apologize, it is in their Privacy Policy DJI Privacy Policy - Everything You Need To Know, not Terms of use. I just read it again. They collect a lot of data about your DJI and non DJI devices including flight record data.

That's like the standard privacy policy for many apps but it doesn't indicate that your flight data is automatically uploaded to DJI.

 

[Theo450]

That's like the standard privacy policy for many apps but it doesn't indicate that your flight data is automatically uploaded to DJI.

I had to research this issue for my client. I had my legal department review the privacy policy. They assured me that DJI is collecting every scrap of data that they are able to, and not necessarily for nefarious purposes. Big data helps them perfect their products. Even if you fly "offline", the moment you do "connect" your device, it is sending data back to the mothership. If you really want to read some scary stuff, read Google's terms of use, or facebook's.

 

[With The Birds]

I had to research this issue for my client. I had my legal department review the privacy policy. They assured me that DJI is collecting every scrap of data that they are able to, and not necessarily for nefarious purposes. Big data helps them perfect their products. Even if you fly "offline", the moment you do "connect" your device, it is sending data back to the mothership. If you really want to read some scary stuff, read Google's terms of use, or facebook's.

Did your legal department engage an IT forensic specialist? Would be interesting to learn exactly what “every scrap of date” actually refers to.

 

[Theo450]

Did your legal department engage an IT forensic specialist? Would be interesting to learn exactly what “every scrap of date” actually refers to.

They did engage out global IT department experts. If you read the policy, it says that they may collect geolocation information from your non-DJI devices. So that means your phone or tablet, and any photos you took on your phone or tablet that are not related to your UAV at all. They collect information on the websites you have visited on your non-DJI device. Google does the same thing as does Facebook.

 

[With The Birds]

They did engage out global IT department experts. If you read the policy, it says that they may collect geolocation information from your non-DJI devices. So that means your phone or tablet, and any photos you took on your phone or tablet that are not related to your UAV at all. They collect information on the websites you have visited on your non-DJI device. Google does the same thing as does Facebook.

Did the global IT experts perform any form of investigation outside reading the “policy”. Sone established facts would be useful.