Tarot 810 (or other)

ladykate · Apr 21, 2014

Oh goody Another problem.

The A2 support for H3-2D is available in version 2.0. The beta for 2.0 was release in October. 2.1 beta was released in December or so. They have pulled both betas from the website. Meaning - I can't use that gimbal with the A2 (at least not yet).

SO.... my knowledgeable friends, what are my options (besides buying a gimbal I don't want)?

EDIT: A2 has two CAN-BUS channels. You must hook the GCU to the 2nd channel - the first one will not drive the GCU. Irritatingly, that particular port is busy and you must buy a CAN-HUB so you can share all the stuff that has to go to it (can't use the GS without a hub even though there are CAN-BUS ports available - they are the wrong type - DJI says you need the hub - this doesn't make sense since I can swing a port off the IOSDII - obviously there are more things to learn).

After several root beers last night, I was able to get it running. I have one channel 1 port free and 1 channel 2 port free - maybe the IOSDII is the key - it has extra ports coming out of it and that may negate the DJI warning.

Boozshey · Apr 22, 2014

Check out the retracts I made...

https://vimeo.com/92678673

ladykate · Apr 22, 2014

Boozshey said:
Check out the retracts I made...

https://vimeo.com/92678673

That should eliminate getting the gear in the camera angle. ;-} Nice job. Did you go with making your own just because? I know you can buy them (wild range in prices). There is a YouTube video on another set - but I couldn't find of the parts he used. They were all out-of-stock.

Boozshey · Apr 22, 2014

Cheaper to make my own. I spent about $60 in parts and supplies. $20 of which wasn't needed but I didn't want to modify the mounts that came with the Hex, this way if these ever fail, I can just swap the other mounts back on without an issue.

ladykate · May 1, 2014

Well... it is done for the initial build. The test flight went well and I added on all the other gear. It is running a Ragecams 5.4 with a simple 2D gimbal. Will put on a 3D gimbal when they come out. Using an AVL58 vtx. Super simple FPV hookup if you stick with DJI parts. No soldering to hook up all the FPV. No BECs needed for 6S either (if you use DJI stuff - it all is handled for you). Will stick on a 12 volt BEC for lights at some future date... I tested them but couldn't decide what configuration I wanted - so I took them off. Might install an IR illuminator - got a nice lens for the camera that works at 850 nm.

I have the switching hooked up for a second video camera but can't make up my mind what I want to install.

My initial thoughts are that the T810 has some issues. The folding landing gear is not as tight as I would want and the way the legs screw in makes them easy to move so that one foot is twisted on takeoff. In addition, one of the landing legs actually fell off while I was working on the machine - literally came out of the socket and fell to the bench. Glad it wasn't during a flight. I super glued it back in.

I don't like the loss of the first deck to the folding gear and wires. Lots of space lost there. I think I would prefer a non-folder with sturdy gear. I had to add a deck extension to put the gimbal out where it needed to be. It now has a fore and aft deck that gives me enough room to add the ground station if I decide to stick it on. As it is, with seven modules and all the leads on the top deck, it is a bit of a rat's nest. Simplifying it more is possible but it would look so much better if I could stick all that crap out of site on the first deck. ;-}

The A2 seems fine. It is stable and easy to set up. It is much like the Naza to configure (and I assume the WKM). However, my complaint about it is that the CAN-BUS connectors are not all the same. You have to be careful which CAN-BUS port you put things. In addition, since the rx and controller are integrated, you cannot test the ESCs with it. You have to use a separate rx or program the throttle to another channel and use the output of the A2 - otherwise the throttle gets interpreted by the A2 and you can't calibrate the ESC.

Handling is very nice - very stable and easy to fly. Once assembled, the airframe seems solid (except for the gear which is OK but not quite as good as I would like). It really does fly like it was an extension of your body. No squirrel moves.

Boozshey · May 1, 2014

Awesome!

jondrew · May 1, 2014

looks good. Post some bigger pics when you have time.

IR Flood eh? Doing night work?

ladykate · May 1, 2014

jondrew said:
looks good. Post some bigger pics when you have time.

IR Flood eh? Doing night work?

Yes. I live near a woods that comes alive at night. Also do work with fireworks and wanted to get some crew shots on a hand fired shoot.

OI Photography · May 1, 2014

Very nice...and yes I'm sure being forced to pack so much on the top deck would drive me nuts too.

The gopro looks a little outclassed by that big rig...you clearly have a lot of headroom to play with in terms of payload capacity

ladykate · May 2, 2014

OI Photography said:
The gopro looks a little outclassed by that big rig...you clearly have a lot of headroom to play with in terms of payload capacity

Doesn't it? Positively dwarfed by that big frame. I will spring for a 3d gimbal when it becomes available. Meanwhile, I should meet my flight time goals with no problem.

I looked into a NEX 5/7 and decided it wasn't worth the advantages it had. The cost of the gimbal and the camera vs performance simply didn't cut it for me. The YouTube videos of that combination were not appreciably better than a standard GoPro or 5.4 although the stability of a better gimbal was noticeable. The Ragecams 5.4 takes great photos (I did a wedding with it a few weeks ago) and it equaled the shots from large Nikon DSLRs for non-flash photos and movies.

There are a couple of good studies using stills and GoPro that also helped persuade me.

So... at least I didn't start by overloading the whole thing. I can bring pizzas and/or beer to our next meet - by air. :lol:

extrememc · May 2, 2014

Nice build ladykate! I am having a F800 (S800 clone) built. Wish I had time to do myself. Like you I am looking at Nex5-7. The ASP gimbals from rctimer are reasonable, but then you add cost of camera now you in upper $800.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

ladykate · May 2, 2014

extrememc said:
Nice build ladykate! I am having a F800 (S800 clone) built. Wish I had time to do myself. Like you I am looking at Nex5-7. The ASP gimbals from rctimer are reasonable, but then you add cost of camera now you in upper $800.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Actually, a Ragecam 5.4 and a gimbal is more expensive than $800 (by almost double) - I really did go by what I felt were better results. I know that will tweak everyone who uses a NEX but the weight, cost, and results didn't add up for me. However, I can always put my rig on my Phantom (the one I'm rebuilding) and get the NEX if I find I screwed it up.

If you are doing this for 'real' professional use (I'm not) then having it built is a good idea in many cases. I'm still going to spend a lot of time (happily) with tweaking and playing with it. Like the 550, it is a forever work in progress. I just have to stay away from golf course ponds. :shock:

ladykate · May 3, 2014

Decided to go out and do an endurance test. Got to 19:40 or so. Learned that the darn thing doesn't degrade gracefully. Hard landing but only a few pieces fell off. :lol:

It wasn't a hover test - I moved back and forth - out about 200 meters and up a hundred or so - showed a passerby who had a 350 what I was doing. It wasn't a heavy workout - maybe what one would do when filming.

http://vimeo.com/93775025

(embedded video not working

it's 10 seconds long so it won't waste your life ;-})

ladykate · May 5, 2014

Well... memo for record. Tarot equipment has to be triple checked. The CF motor mount on number 2 engine gave up all of its screws in flight. While I checked everything I could think of during the build, I did not take those screws out and juice them. Should have. Did it to all the other screws. Note that my motor mount screws (the three in the picture) held. I checked the other five motors and they were all tight so this is just plain strange.

Good news is that the 810 is completely controllable with a lost motor. It was weird. I heard a 'clack' and noticed a heavy yaw - it spun around once very quickly and I applied some counter yaw and it actually straightened up. I was able to bring it down from about 60 meters and over to a soft spot to land. It landed like it always does (settles down and stops). Only damage is probably the prop - though I want to triple check the motor to make sure it didn't bend the shaft. Even the prop is salvageable. When the motor flipped, it pulled two of its leads loose and it simply stopped. Very weird looking when you are bringing down a hex with a motor hanging upside down off it.

Edit - just found this on the camera - kinda shows why I was anxious to get it down. Also shows the dead prop.

OI Photography · May 5, 2014

Wow...an awesome recovery from what could have been a very unpleasant catastrophe. I'm glad to hear the NAZA pulled that off as well as the Wookong, and yeah flying a hex with a missing axis is kind of like trying to drive a car with one extremely flat tire

One of the two accidents I've had in my 550 was due to me not securing the prop adapter screws (and not checking them before each flight), and the whole thing...adaptor and prop and all...came flying off all of a sudden. It even knocked off 1" off the blade from the next nearest arm, but still recovered and handled better than I could have ever hoped for.

I get the feeling that it may be easier for the FC to handle this kind of situation when it's a bigger rig like these and there's plenty of power/torque overhead to juggle it in an emergency.

ladykate · May 5, 2014

Yes - I wasn't flying NAZA but A2. However, I think you might be right about larger airframes having the ability to compensate better. While I didn't study the situation very much ( I was trying to get it down before the motor fell off in some deep weeds) - I was sweating adrenaline until I noticed the platform had steadied itself. I then flew it closer to me and got it on the ground in a nice place. In retrospect, it was a neat experience - but in the future, I would just as soon it not happen again. :|

update: I checked the screws by hand at the site but when I got it back, two motors had two or three screws that seemed to have been tightened to the binding paint and stopped (they felt tight but were several turns from being tight) and one other had a single screw the same way. This is definitely a check list item from now on!

OI Photography · May 5, 2014

ladykate said:
In retrospect, it was a neat experience - but in the future, I would just as soon it not happen again. :|

Bingo...it was a "singular experience" that I'm glad I have under my belt, but hope to never face again. When it happened, everything went in to "Oh Sh..." slo-mo mode in my brain, which at first made me think I had imagined how smoothly it all went down (pun intended), but my spotter confirmed that it was as graceful as it had looked to me.

I forgot you have the A2 on your 810, I'm still waiting to hear a story from one of us of a NAZA having to recover from that.

FangsCPO · May 5, 2014

ladykate said:
Well... memo for record. Tarot equipment has to be triple checked. The CF motor mount on number 2 engine gave up all of its screws in flight. While I checked everything I could think of during the build, I did not take those screws out and juice them. Should have. Did it to all the other screws. Note that my motor mount screws (the three in the picture) held. I checked the other five motors and they were all tight so this is just plain strange.

Good news is that the 810 is completely controllable with a lost motor. It was weird. I heard a 'clack' and noticed a heavy yaw - it spun around once very quickly and I applied some counter yaw and it actually straightened up. I was able to bring it down from about 60 meters and over to a soft spot to land. It landed like it always does (settles down and stops). Only damage is probably the prop - though I want to triple check the motor to make sure it didn't bend the shaft. Even the prop is salvageable. When the motor flipped, it pulled two of its leads loose and it simply stopped. Very weird looking when you are bringing down a hex with a motor hanging upside down off it.

Edit - just found this on the camera - kinda shows why I was anxious to get it down. Also shows the dead prop.

Wow!!! Assume save. I see all that water out there..........I know how you must have felt....believe me I do.

ladykate · May 5, 2014

FangsCPO said:
Wow!!! Assume save. I see all that water out there..........I know how you must have felt....believe me I do.

Such a sinking feeling when you first detect that it is doing something it isn't supposed to do. I was expecting a fall from the sky but the darn thing practically saved itself. If it had landed in the river there would be no pieces to pick up (the Missouri is fast and fairly deep right there - no one goes in it (and comes back out).