Solution for P4 range/battery life issues - Updated with Contact from DJI!

[bighi]

What's my take on this after today? I love the phantom 4 for finally having what looks like a shell that can take the heat. I really dig the speed. Not just in sport mode, but newbie assist off P mode. But the FPV should be as good if not better than prior. After all, nobody bought a 991 series 911 to go slower than a 997. And hell, even Porsche fesses up on their screw ups. Trust me, I know because I live half the year in the family's home town where the videos above were made. As for the flight duration, I'm biased. Yeah, I'm bugged that my mountain flights are lasting not a minute longer with the phantom 4, but I can take it. Turning around from having candle light bridge on the P4 instead of proper light bridge, to me sucks a lot more. If DJI had said "phantom mode itself will be 3 mph faster on average but still at the same flight time, OK. Catch is they didn't.

Anyway, while maybe I could more flight time out of my phantom 4 if maybe I tried harder, longer FPV range has been impossible after one week of trying. Maybe if I were on an FCC phantom 4. Maybe. But then again, that would also mean an FCC phantom 3.

On a side note, I bound my phantom 3 GL300B controller to my phantom 4. I noticed better FPV.

 

[Davphys]

I hope you say precisely that to Michael Perry.
And I hope you tell him that you get better range when you bind your old P3P controller to the P4.

Crippled LightBridge at a more premium price is unacceptable. I think the vast majority of us would rather have better range and flight times then tap to fly or active track.

What's my take on this after today? I love the phantom 4 for finally having what looks like a shell that can take the heat. I really dig the speed. Not just in sport mode, but newbie assist off P mode. But the FPV should be as good if not better than prior. After all, nobody bought a 991 series 911 to go slower than a 997. And hell, even Porsche fesses up on their screw ups. Trust me, I know because I live half the year in the family's home town where the videos above were made. As for the flight duration, I'm biased. Yeah, I'm bugged that my mountain flights are lasting not a minute longer with the phantom 4, but I can take it. Turning around from having candle light bridge on the P4 instead of proper light bridge, to me sucks a lot more. If DJI had said "phantom mode itself will be 3 mph faster on average but still at the same flight time, OK. Catch is they didn't.

Anyway, while maybe I could more flight time out of my phantom 4 if maybe I tried harder, longer FPV range has been impossible after one week of trying. Maybe if I were on an FCC phantom 4. Maybe. But then again, that would also mean an FCC phantom 3.

On a side note, I bound my phantom 3 GL300B controller to my phantom 4. I noticed better FPV.

 

[bighi]

It's not light bridge any more. Welcome to candle light bridge. Amazing. More than double the price of a phantom 3 advanced and inferior FPV.

Anyway, I sent Michael Perry a very long email. I sent another to Frank Wang a few days ago as well.

Today's flight was about the best I could muster out of my phantom 4. And if you folks view the videos which were done at the same time, conditions, standing position, routes, etc, the phantom 3, as in the past, always outperformed the phantom 4 in FPV. Again, I love the phantom 4 and I hope that DJI can rectify this sad state of affairs. Not just for us customers, but for themselves as well since it is an otherwise far higher quality phantom.

 

[GadgetGuy]

A little birdie told me the email of DJI's head "user experience" guy:
[email protected]

I have emailed him as well. Feel free to forward your experiences onward and upward to these gentlemen who gave us the specs!

Btw, the chief engineer for the Phantom 4 is Paul Pan:
[email protected]

Did you teach your P4 to talk?
I'm going to get mine all liquored up, and get her to spill her guts, too!

 

[GadgetGuy]

I would expect them to be aware of the concerns and fix whatever they can via firmware updates.
If you don't think that companies pay attention to user complaints- especially to those at the top- and act accordingly then you are sorely mistaken. I have had direct email conversations with the CEO of Apple to this very effect and they have directly responded to the things that I communicated both in words and in action.

Then, may I suggest you email the Apple CEO and alert him of DJI's advertising shenanigans, which now also reflect very poorly on Apple, as DJI's marketing partner?

Include in that email DJI's refusal to allow any returns from any DJI online sales, if the customer has ever flown the P4 to discover first hand what BS the touted 3.1 mile range and 28+ minute battery life are!

Apple's CEO is far more likely to have a direct influence on DJI than all of us combined!

 

[GadgetGuy]

I just received this:

Thank you for writing. Let me preface the below by saying we believe in our products and stand behind them. We do understand that they’re not for everybody. But the P4 is the best Phantom we’ve ever built. If you are dissatisfied with the Phantom 4, you should do what you think is right for you. I will not try to pressure you either way.

From our side, 28 minutes is not under ideal conditions. It’s a reasonable and accurate amount of flight time we arrived at based on facts after many, many months of flight. It would help to have more details about how and where you were flying and what the battery’s charge levels were at start and finish. There are too many variables for me to comment or address anything specific, and while the forums are often extremely helpful for the aerial enthusiast community, there’s also a lot that goes out on the forums that are not based on clear details or facts. Nobody has had the Phantom 4 in the air for longer than a few days at this point, so it’s important to do due diligence.

Also, on what are you basing the assertion that “t seems there has been about a 20-25% decrease in the power from the transmitter?” Who conducted what tests, where, using what equipment to measure the power? Compared to what? I’m not contesting what you’re saying. I’m merely noting that without those kinds of details, I have no way of evaluating accuracy or not.

If you have some more details to provide, I am happy to pursue this further.

Best,
naj

Point him to the FCC ID #'s for the GL300A, GL300B, and GL300C transmitters.

The GL300C has 20% less power output at .303 watts than the other two, at 0.38 watts, once the misplaced decimal on the GL300A and GL300B is corrected.

Further, the WM330A P4 aircraft also has 20% less power output for video FPV at 0.598 watts than the W323 P3P aircraft, which put out 0.746 watts.

Also, all of our real world tests, documented in our posts, with these respective aircraft and transmitters confirm the corresponding range reductions in both control distance and FPV distance, when comparing the P4 to the P3P, over an identical course, on back to back flights!

 

[bracKopter]

20% less power really shouldn't effect range that much. Antenna sensitivity has a much more profound effect. Did you know you have to increase output power 4x to double range? It follows the inverse square law.

Inverse-square law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[GadgetGuy]

20% less power really shouldn't effect range that much. Antenna sensitivity has a much more profound effect. Did you know you have to increase output power 4x to double range? It follows the inverse square law.

Inverse-square law - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The difference between "shouldn't" and "does," in this case, is night and day.
Whether it is due to the changes in power specs or something else that DJI has done, that always coincides with the power reductions, the power reductions linearly reflect the changes in control range and range of video FPV stability. I have over 250 flights over the last 10 months in the same area, testing the W323 P3P, the W323A P3P, the W322 P3A, and now the WM330A P4. The P4 is just as bad as the W323A, and has almost the same power reduction over the original W323, and the GL300C RC also is the worst, featuring a 20% power reduction over the GL300A and GL300B.

 

[bighi]

I saw a substantial improvement yesterday after binding my phantom 4 to my GL300B controller. After binding the controller required a firmware update which I did. I took off and the difference was noticeable.

 

[GadgetGuy]

I saw a substantial improvement yesterday after binding my phantom 4 to my GL300B controller. After binding the controller required a firmware update which I did. I took off and the difference was noticeable.

GL300B (and GL300A) control output power at 0.38 watts is 25% more than the P4’s GL300C at .303 watts. Expect 25% more distance by changing. YMMV.

 

[Mad_angler1]

GL300B (and GL300A) control output power at 0.38 watts is 25% more than the P4’s GL300C at .303 watts. Expect 25% more distance by changing. YMMV.

Hats just simply not true

You would have to double power to see a 25% increase in range

You can't ignore the laws of physics be issue they don't fit in with your assumptions.


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[bracKopter]

I wasn't ignoring your observations. I was simply pointing out that the change in output power doesn't represent the complete picture as to why.

 

[GadgetGuy]

Hats just simply not true

You would have to double power to see a 25% increase in range

You can't ignore the laws of physics be issue they don't fit in with your assumptions.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

All fine and good.
So how do you then explain why the GL300C is so much worse than the GL300A or GL300A, and why the P4 video and control drops out so much sooner than on a W323 P3P in the exact same area? Those are facts, not theories. Fact is that the P4 and the GL300C both have 20% less power output from each device, compared to the P3P W323 and a GL300A.

 

[GadgetGuy]

I wasn't ignoring your observations. I was simply pointing out that the change in output power doesn't represent the complete picture as to why.

I agree, but what else are we missing???
Because whatever we are missing, whatever else it is, is either the key to fixing the problem, or the reason it can't or won't be changed.

 

[dewster]

Gut feeling tells me Frankie Wang was dragged into a closed-door meeting with the FAA last year and explicitly told to reduce output power on the P4 and all future DJI products or else face some "uncomfortable" pressure from them and the CAA and other civil aviation authorities.

Unlike Tim Cook, Mr. Wang wants to play nice with governments that are too eager to shut down the entire drone hobby because of the reckless reports coming in from airport sightings and so forth.

It's a sad reality --- pretty soon flying a drone will mean standing in your backyard and watching a plastic toy buzz around at 40 ft. max altitude and 100 ft. max range. Basically, take a $30 Air Hogs helicopter and reduce it's capabilities by 50% and that's our future.

It's not only DJI playing nice with government aviation authorities. Yuneec, and 3D Robotics are too. Every major player will make compliant drones to avoid heavy regulation or a complete ban as some have proposed.


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[Bocephus-73]

Also, all of our real world tests, documented in our posts, with these respective aircraft and transmitters confirm the corresponding range reductions in both control distance and FPV distance, when comparing the P4 to the P3P, over an identical course, on back to back flights!

Frankie Wang will NEVER cop to the truth about the P4 --- he had his little shakedown with the FAA last fall and he fell in line like the little whipped puppy that he is. He's a typical CEO, folks --- he needs to deliver solid financial quarters to the shareholders or else he is out of a job! He knows **** well that TapFly and ActiveTracking are big selling points to all the noobs and that will offset any disgruntled feelings about reduced range and fraudulent claims about flight times.

Sorry but if we all get in bed and spoon with Frank Wang, it ain't gonna make a **** bit of difference to boost the range of the P4. He's now a lap dog for the FAA and he's not going to test their patience with any more long-distance Phantoms.

 

[happydays]

He's a typical CEO, folks --- he needs to deliver solid financial quarters to the shareholders or else he is out of a job!

Isn't DJI a private company - ie no shareholders?

 

[robinb]

Isn't DJI a private company - ie no shareholders?

Yes

 

[frankieo11]

ITs really unfortunate. I sold my P3P in anticipation of buying the P4, but Im holding off considering the news about the battery life and range. I wont be buying it unless its addressed, which means I'll be Phantomless. What a bummer.

 

[Mad_angler1]

All fine and good.
So how do you then explain why the GL300C is so much worse than the GL300A or GL300A, and why the P4 video and control drops out so much sooner than on a W323 P3P in the exact same area? Those are facts, not theories. Fact is that the P4 and the GL300C both have 20% less power output from each device, compared to the P3P W323 and a GL300A.

For starters the remote output difference are irrelevant as controller signal will go far beyond what video will anyhow so the only real part interest is craft output

There are a million reasons for this, for starter when people are comparing are you selecting manual channels and the 4mb on both craft, you can't test this in auto as the craft may chose different channels.

Second CE areas get 75% less output that FCC and you have not seen people posting constantly about the poor range compared to FCC, I have flown a P3 with 16dbi almost 3 miles no problem.

Finally actually the P4 has 1db more in CE than the P3.

There are limited reports of Inspire users of having range issues since the latest controller FW update.

If your getting substantially less range than say the P3 you fist need to test both craft on the same channel and same data rate, make sure antennas are correctly aligned and of its the same I'd contact DJI support




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