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Removing PV2+ camera & training advice

Discussion in 'Phantom 2 Vision + Discussion' started by timtown, Sep 17, 2014.

  1. timtown

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    I have not flown this plane before writing this query, but in my experience in flying quads, I usually find a way to crash them. While I have an aftermarket gimbal guard installed under the landing legs, I would like to further protect my investment by removing the gimbal/camera altogether. I notice that the gimbal is attached by two plastic rods with each rod having a anchor that passes through a one-way washer. Is there a simple way to remove the two rods while protecting the two one-way washers for reuse?

    I've ordered a new set from DJI but they haven't arrived yet from HongKong wherever.

    NEXT question: I've been advised to fly/train in the manual mode (S1 in 3rd position, I think) without using any flight control aids. I've flown the mini L'l Dragan trainer with moderate success in 3-5 mph winds. I've also flown 4-6 other quads indoors.

    So, do you recommend starting out in manual mode? If not, in what other mode?

    Thanks for the advice, Tim
     
  2. Meta4

    Meta4 Moderator
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    The Phantom is much easier to fly than any other quad you've tried.
    Whoever recommended starting out in manual mode either knows nothing or they hate you.
    The default Phantom GPS mode is the only way to start.
    It has a lot of built-in safety.
    Beginning in manual mode you will crash.

    You can remove the camera but that also removes your telemetry so you can't see any of the good things DJI has given you to help flying.
    You will not have any indication of battery level, GPS sats, distance, altitude, speed or the radar display.
    It is possible to get the drop pins out without destroying them but it's fiddly.

    Again don't even imagine starting in manual mode.
     
  3. timtown

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    Thank you Meta4 for your comments.

    I'm very familiar with the flight controllers like NAZA, pixhawk, and others plus the sensors they use, etc. My intent was only to practice launching and landing, then to control the aircraft manually for
    the "box" training exercise to get the feel for the controls. Every copter I have behaves differently when flown w/o
    stability controls.
    I was not intending to use manual mode in normal flying, especially beyond a radius of 15'. Some else on this blog recommended that I remove the camera/gimbal during training; seems like
    prudent advice, since I'm not needing telemetry during this initial honeymoon training.

    Should the automated components of the plane fail for one reason or another, my only fallback is to land the plane immediately or attempt to get it back closer to where I'm located. In such
    situations, isn't one expected to fly the plane "manually", perhaps relying on altitude stabilization? Therefore, it behooves me to get experience with this plane's peculiarities before flying over greater
    distances, heights, and time and tackling the telemetry feedback learning. Don't you think this is true?

    Regards, Tim
     
  4. Meta4

    Meta4 Moderator
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    I think you're over-thinking this.
    The Phantom is very, very easy to fly. Much easier than you imagine.
    Just read the manual, ask questions about anything that's unclear and then take your Phantom to a clear, open area with no trees and buildings and give it a go.
     
  5. RIDETOEAT

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    I was asking the same questions a week or two ago and I ended up leaving mine together. You will find it is so unbelievably easy to fly that there is really no need if you fly it like a camera ship. If you want to fly acro with it you bought the wrong bird but I doubt that is the case. Do your checks for updates and go fly. If you understand what the naza modes can do for you I would turn them on for day one as well. I did not but now think it is appropriate.

    Doug...
     
  6. timtown

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    Ok, let me ask a slightly different question about manual mode. Under what circumstances does DJI depend on your use of the Manual mode? My assumption has been that Manual mode is used during one or more failure modes of the plane. I certainly understand the delights of using the plane's automation, the ease of flying it, and I plan to use it, of course.

    If I'm wrong, then please correct me and speculate why DJI included the mode in the first place.

    Thanks, Tim
     
  7. Meta4

    Meta4 Moderator
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    I haven't encountered any circumstances under which you would have to use manual mode but I've only been flying this year.
    If you have an unobstructed view of the sky, you will have plenty of GPS sats to guide you. If you fly indoors, under tree cover or in a canyon and lose sats, the bird cuts over to atti mode and still maintains altitude as well as knowing which way it is facing. Manual mode is hardly ever used, and only by a very small number of curious users. Most would never have used it at all as there is no need to.
     
  8. wharfbanger

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    No one on this forum flys in manual mode. Removing the hard plastic pins is probably a good idea, regardless of what else you do. They are unnecessary and may be the cause of many broken camera/gimbal assemblies, when they transmit the shock of an impact to the lower gimbal shaft that connects the camera to the gimbal. This shaft easily snaps. I have flown 50+ flights without those pins, after losing my first camera to a hard landing.
     
  9. chagalj

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    Which pins are those exactly?
     
  10. Jstic

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    I got rid of those silly plastic pins and caps and replaced them with these: http://www.ebay.com/itm/261576678867?_trksid=p2060778.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK:MEBIDX:IT

    They are called binding posts and you can get them in aluminum. Very easy to put on and take off.

    You can still fly in GPS mode with the camera off, you have all the failsafes that GPS mode offers, you just don't have telemetry. I took my camera off in the beginning and saved myself $700 in doing so. Not being experienced with RC aircraft, I was learning from scratch. After about 25 flights I put it back on and have been fine since.
     
  11. sbarton

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    If you remove the gimbal/camera, you will lose FPV and telemetry. Would probably be harder to fly without the FPV and telemetry, increasing your chances of crashing.

    -Scott
     
  12. memaus03

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    Hi Jstic

    Did you have to do anything else to get the quad to power up when you took the camera off? I've taken mine off after a crash but now it wont power up (it did power up with the broken gimbal but went beserk first). What am I missing here?

    Thanks
     
  13. singapore_phantom

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    I think Tim is referring to ATTI mode. Yes Tim, ATTI is more "manual" than GPS mode but in ATTI you still have access to gyros, compass and barometer.

    "Manual' in the Phantom context is flying without any of this intelligence. Your copter will know not to flip will-nilly, but apart from this it's up to the pilot to keep it from dropping out of the sky. It's tough and not for the uninitiated.

    However, in most cases, should you run into any satellite issues with your Phantom, then ATTI, which you can consider a kind of Manual Light, will get you home most of the time.

    Only go Manual when you're a pro.
     
  14. BlackTracer

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    The P2V+ is ridiculously easy to fly right out of the box. Do not start out in full manual mode, no way. That is an upside down learning method that I and everyone else on this forum would never recommend. You would be disabling all the features meant to make it easy to fly. Try it in Phantom mode first (factory settings), staying low and close, until you see how easy it is. Then switch into NAZA soon after. I would say 99% of owners have done it this way.

    If you bought it new, it comes with an extra set of the plastic pins. So if you must remove the gimbal and camera, just cut them off and put the spares on when you put the gimbal back on. I totally disagree with whoever said take them off anyway, you dont need them. To me they are like seat belts in a car. Your chances of survival are better if you dont exit or get tossed around in the car in an accident. A lot of us have even placed small zip ties in the other two mounts for extra security.

    DO NOT START OUT IN MANUAL MODE!!!! You may survive it if you do, but most likely you will be sorry you did.
     
  15. Panamon Creel

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    Start with GPS-Atti mode, move on to Atti only mode once you have a feel for it and much later on if you feel the need for a challenge, want to push the limits or want to do some stunt flying you can try Manual mode.
     
  16. N017RW

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    My opinion varies from this.

    I do not have FPV or OSD and I never feel like I'm at a disadvantage or it's harder for any reason.

    One could argue that having a screen to distract a learning pilot may add risk.
    Learning should be done close by and LOS only.

    TEHO
     
  17. Fplvert

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    :D totally agree with BlackTracer here. With your prior experience, Tim, taking your camera and gimbal off is silly. You won't crash in GPS mode.
     
  18. Jstic

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    Are you saying the entire quad won't power up when you turn the battery on? Or do you mean the camera won't power up? If you are talking about the camera, it sounds like you don't have all the connectors fully seated. I'm talking about the three connectors that plug into the top of the gimbal, one has a clip and you can tell easily when it snaps into place, the other two only have very small "dot" type locks which makes it harder to tell if it is seated all the way in the connector. I use a pair of tweezers and push down on the connector from both ends to get it seated correctly.