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  1. apex1

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    I recently bought a PolarPro P4 gimbal guard directly from PolarPro, and the service was great--it arrived quickly. It snaps on easily and securely. The question I have is whether it is safe to use. PolarPro states that it is designed to work with P4 VPS sensors, yet there are persistent posts here by folks with high post counts that have lots more experience than I have that gimbal guards are not safe to use with a P4--period. I'm not sure what prompts these warnings, other than antecdotal non-scientific evaluations based on personal experience with some brand of guard, plus other posts here. And I very much appreciate these warnings and posts. On the other hand, I have great respect for PolarPro and my thought is that a P4 gimbal guard would not be sold by them unless their engineers and testers determined they were 100% safe if mounted just out of camera view with the drone level. I have not experienced problems when I have flown with mine, but I currently have it off because I've been scared by the warnings. Does anyone here have experience either positive or negative with one? Jeff--please feel free to give us PolarPro's point of view as to its safety and thoroughness of testing and engineering. Thanks.
     
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  2. PolarPro

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    Thank you very much for the purchase!
    As long as the gimbal guard is installed properly there is nothing to worry about. The gimbal guard needs to be pushed far forward as possible (without obstructing the camera)

    A good way to test and make sure it is clear of the sensors is to hold the P4 shoulder level above the ground. If your monitor is showing 4 to 5 ft of altitude the gimbal guard is installed correctly and out of the way of the VPS sensors. If your monitor shows a 0ft altitude, the GG is too far back.

    In addition to that safety check I usually will do a low hover with mine and make sure everything is operating smoothly.

    Indicators it is not installed properly:
    1. altitude on monitor shows 0 when the P4 is not on the ground
    2. random altitude drops during flight

    Hope that helps!

    Jeff
     
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  3. MGR457

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    Nothing to worry about? DJI claims they can easily tell if a gimbal guard is installed and, in the event of a crash, will not honor the warranty. That's plenty to worry about.
     
  4. PolarPro

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    Hi MGR457,
    If our Gimbal Guard is installed correctly it does not interfere with the sensors, however if you are worried about installation or using a gimbal guard then I would recommend not to use one.
    -Jeff
     
  5. MGR457

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    Dear PolarPro:
    I currently have a PolarPro gimbal lock that clips on the camera, which I do like. I also have another brand gimbal lock that connects to the legs. I have not had problems, however, if I were to crash my P4, DJI will analyze data and determine if a gimbal guard was present. Given their history, they would blame it on the gimbal guard. I know, you want to sell product, but... DJI will most likely disregard what PolarPro, or any other 3rd party, engineers say. The result will be the consumer left holding the bag, because if DJI said the cause was YOUR gimbal guard, I am pretty sure you won't accept responsibility and replace the consumers crashed drone.
     
    #5 MGR457, Oct 18, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2016
  6. PolarPro

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    We provide you with the tools, and it is up to you to decide whether to use them or not. Unfortunately we can not control DJI policies, we just make helpful products for customers to use if they wish.

    -Jeff
     
  7. MGR457

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    Sure you do. And, have you considered posting a Disclaimer on your "tools" that states DJI Warranty MAY be voided by use of your product? Didn't think so....
     
    #7 MGR457, Oct 18, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2016
  8. PolarPro

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    I appreciate your concern and feedback,
    We have zero evidence that OUR SPECIFIC product will void the warranty if installed correctly.

    -Jeff
     
  9. MGR457

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    Exactly my point. In the event of a crash, DJI will blame it on the gimbal guard; PolarPro will say "there is NO evidence", and the consumer will be left holding the bag (of broken drone pieces.)

    Look, I like most of PolarPro products. I purchased a full filter set, and as previously mentioned, the other gimbal lock that mounts on the camera. But, in light of DJIs stance on 3rd party gimbal guards, a disclaimer would be the ethical thing to provide the uninformed consumer.
     
    #9 MGR457, Oct 18, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2016
  10. PolarPro

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    I appreciate your input, and we certainly appreciate you as a customer, however the hypothetical situation you have described above has never happened.
    -Jeff
     
  11. MGR457

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    Yet....and if it does, what will PolarPro's stance be? Again, consumer holding the bag. Honestly, I am not impressed with DJIs position on 3rd party accessories. That being said, a company such as PolarPro should at least acknowledge the possibility, if not probability of a loss of a vehicle, with DJIs presumptive and FINAL denial of Warranty. With that in mind, it would be responsible and highly regarded to at least post a disclaimer. For a company, such as PolarPro to know DJIs position on gimbal guards and not post some kind of disclaimer points to the underlying cause....you don't want to lose potential sales.
     
    #11 MGR457, Oct 18, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2016
  12. PolarPro

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    Again, Appreciative of the great feedback, however we do not have a stance on an event that has not occurred. If you are personally are not comfortable using the gimbal guard, you are more than welcome not to use it and we would be more than happy to give you a refund. We acknowledge the possibility of loss if vehicle with DJI's standpoint, we also acknowledge the possibility of you crashing your drone into a lake, falling over while installing the gimbal guard, dropping your drone while installing the gimbal guard, having a bird try to attack the gimbal guard during flight...all are possibilities, however none have happened, so this is why we do not include it, the list of hypotheticals is too long and just that...hypothetical. In a period of 8 months it has not happened, so while I appreciate your concern and feedback in helping make us a more ethical company, I can assure you we already are an extremely ethical company and are very appreciate of our customers.
     
  13. MGR457

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    The wild-hair hypotheticals you posted, ignore the root complaint....in the event of a drone crash (outside of your wild-hair hypotheticals), should DJI choose to blame the gimbal guard, based on THEIR data, and THEIR presumptive blame of fault with the gimbal guard, each company will be finger-pointing at the other guy...leaving the consumer with nothing. 8 months is a very short time period to presume your product will NEVER be blamed on a crash. Such a bold statement is irresponsible. Your company should discuss your product with DJI. Maybe some good can come out of it. In the meantime, a Disclaimer gets my vote.
     
    #13 MGR457, Oct 18, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2016
  14. PolarPro

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    That is a great idea, we will try to facilitate a conversion with DJI, I am assuming timeline for that is going to take a bit.
    All the best, We appreciate your thoughts and concern,
    -Jeff
     
  15. MGR457

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    Look...I really hate DJIs carte-blanche blame of any crash using a 3rd party accessory, as the cause of the crash...I do.

    DJI has a known history of blaming almost anyone but themselves, with a few exceptions here and there....call it growing pains.

    That being said, ALL gimbal guards that attach to the legs of the Phantom vehicles are in the cross-hairs. There are already several forum threads of DJI denial of warranty due to 3rd party gimbal guards.

    I am not saying that I agree with DJI...however, acknowledging that a drone crash being blamed on YOUR gimbal guard is highly inevitable (whether that can be disproved or not by your company) is reason enough to notify the unsuspecting and novice consumers of the possibility of warranty claim denial by DJI. At least, they would be provided the opportunity to consider all the factors before making their purchase.
     
    #15 MGR457, Oct 18, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2016
  16. PolarPro

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    Thank you again for the feedback. Our stance is it is not a high enough probability to warrant a warning on the product.
     
  17. WWK888

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    I think both of you have made your points...honestly if my bird crashed, why would I even mention it had a gimbal guard on it to DJI? How could they determine if one was on? I did use a gimbal guard once and I must not have put it in the correct position and the bird acted erratic so I took it off and never used it again. Kudos to Jeff for being professional, I would not hesitate to buy any product he sells if it met my needs.


    Sent from my iPad using PhantomPilots
     
  18. John Locke

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    I had a gimbal guard installed from another vendors on my p4 and experienced the famous 40' yoyo effect. I didn't know it was caused by the gimbal guard at the time. When I contacted DJI to get help they requested my flight logs for an example yoyo flight, along with the video capture. They issued an RMA, paid for shipping and I shipped the P4 to dji without the gimbal guard, because they said to make sure to remove all accessories from the craft, which I did. 9 days later I got a brand new P4, it had a new serial number and I had to register it to fly. They never ask me about my gimbal guard. A couple days later I learned in this forum that someone figured out gimbal guards causes the yoyo. I'm wondering why dji didn't ask me about a gimbal guard, or deny warranty. Maybe they know more now and I was lucky, not sure. If the camera can't see the polar pro guard, seems there's no way to detect its use. The simple ground test seems to confirm its mounted right.
     
  19. MGR457

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    It does appear that DJI, at one time, did not have an issue with gimbal guards, but have since changed their position. On the DJI forum, one of the mods, DJI-Palladin, seemed to endorse them. Then, somebody's drone crashed, DJIs engineers claimed it was due to erroneous altitude readings from the transonics and barometer, caused by the gimbal guard. Now, one of the better DJI mods (DJI Ken), says they are not approved devices.

    So, I am happy DJI treated you fairly and properly replaced your drone with a new one. And, in this instance, it is likely that your case was handled before they switched policy.

    Honestly, I think PolarPro makes great products. Conversely, I disagree with a LOT of DJIs presumptive policies. They too make great products, but their customer service sorely lacks in a lot of areas, and they seem to be quick to blame any 3rd party accessory as the cause of lost or damaged vehicles.

    I think there is a real possibility, if not probability, that PolarPros gimbal guards, if properly installed, are invisible to the sonars on the Phantom vehicles. I would like to know, the transonic "pattern" that is emitted.... conical, flat, width of beam, sweeping or pulsing, etc. What diagnostic equipment would allow you to "see" the pattern.
    ?....not my area of operation, so I have no way of knowing if such equipment exists.

    Knowing that, conclusions could be drawn that would allow exceptions to DJIs policy regarding gimbal guards. Certainly, of all the guards out there, some have distinctly better designs, and therefore would warrant DJIs approval for use.

    Thanks for the reply, glad to hear happy endings, happy droning!
     
  20. MGR457

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    Thanks for the reply. DJI claims that they can diagnostically confirm a gimbal guard was present by comparing barometric and transonic readings from the flight data. Whether that is true or not, they call the shots when it comes to honoring their warranty.

    To be clear, I like PolarPro products. I would buy from them again, if they offered a product I needed.

    This post was made in the interest of companies providing full disclosure for products they sell to consumers who just bought a very expensive product, and might otherwise reconsider, if provided key information that they were not aware of.

    That being said, I fully understand that it is a stretch to presume many consumers who purchase these drones will actually take the time to read and learn about their product.

    Happy droning!
     
    #20 MGR457, Oct 19, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2016