Phantom 2 Vision for a newbie in this hobby?

[HarryT]

I wish we knew what the profit margin is on the different phantoms, since it is probably true that the advice you got was really an opinion and nôt based on facts or stats.

It was certainly an opinion, but it was based the facts of what they, as a DJI repair centre, see coming in to them. They get a significantly higher proportion of V+'s in for repair than any other model Phantom, and the repair costs are generally higher, due to the expensive camera/gimbal unit.

You can ask them yourself if you don't believe me . Their email address is "[email protected]".

 

[ProfessorStein]

I think Wedeliver's point was that their opinion could have been biased by other factors... such as how much they get in profit selling a P2V vs. selling a P2V+. Valid point.

I wouldn't THINK there'd be a huge difference in profit margin between the two, but definitely possible. I do believe that they wouldn't have the reputation they have if they gave biased opinions, however. Just my observation.

 

[HarryT]

I think Wedeliver's point was that their opinion could have been biased by other factors... such as how much they get in profit selling a P2V vs. selling a P2V+. Valid point.

Certainly a valid point, but as an extremely reputable dealer (they're the main supplier for the film and TV industry in the UK) I do trust them to offer unbiased advice because, as they told me, they want me as a customer for the long term, and they won't achieve that by selling me the wrong kit.

 

[Lowepg]

To be fair, Meta4, when I had my mind set on buying a Vision+, my dealer, Heliguy, strongly urged me not to do so. They are a "tier 1" DJI dealer in the UK and ARE experts, while I am certainly not. In their view, the Vision+ is extremely unreliable and has far more problems than any other Phantom model. Almost any crash will damage the camera/gimbal unit, which is a very, very expensive replacement part. This is their view, based on the number of P2 V+'s that they get returned to them for repair.

Of course you're absolutely right in saying that crashing is not inevitable, but for a beginner in the hobby, I'm sure you'll agree that it's highly likely. I've been flying RC models for more years than I care to remember, and I've crashed my P2 through pure pilot error, even though I would consider myself to be an experienced pilot.

That's interesting.

So what exactly DID they recommend as a better alternative?

 

[HarryT]

That's interesting.

So what exactly DID they recommend as a better alternative?

They recommended a P2 to me, and I'm very happy with it. But that's not to say it would be right for everyone, of course, and all I would suggest to the earlier poster is that he talk to a good dealer and get their advice. They are the experts.

 

[Lowepg]

That's interesting.

So what exactly DID they recommend as a better alternative?

They recommended a P2 to me, and I'm very happy with it. But that's not to say it would be right for everyone, of course, and all I would suggest to the earlier poster is that he talk to a good dealer and get their advice. They are the experts.

So what would a Bill of materials look like for a P2 if you wanted FPV?

Im assuming:
base P2 $579
fpv setup $350 (?)
gimbel $250
gopro $300
extra battery $129

So give or take $1600 vs $1230 for the P2V+?

I guess this might be more economical for folks that already have a go pro as well....

I understand the potential desire for the more modular approach in the event of repair, but it DOES seem like you pay a premium up front for that possible benefit.

 

[un hombre]

That is not entirely true, because you can buy a simple gimbal which costs around 70 dollars on banggood, another 70 for Mobius camera, so you save around 350 dollars, it night be even a good set up for first timer and upgrade mater if you want... Now that I think of it, it could be a nice option, plus, in that price I could have fpv glasses which would mean a real fpv experience... Hmmm... Still, Vision is a nice out of the box experience.

 

[un hombre]

I guess British suppliers are no go, not competetive at 724 pounds minimum price, when EU recommended is 799 Euro...

 

[Lowepg]

That is not entirely true, because you can buy a simple gimbal which costs around 70 dollars on banggood, another 70 for Mobius camera, so you save around 350 dollars, it night be even a good set up for first timer and upgrade mater if you want... Now that I think of it, it could be a nice option, plus, in that price I could have fpv glasses which would mean a real fpv experience... Hmmm... Still, Vision is a nice out of the box experience.

Fair point, I was looking at the "equivalent" gimbal and camera that the retailer was suggesting in lieu of the V+.

However, considering your options, what you've got is essentially the SAME price as a loaded P2V+, but traded off for a cheap 2-axis gimbal and a cheap camera.

I'm not seeing how thats necessarily a good option?

 

[un hombre]

Ok, I did a bit more analysis and narrowed my choice to two options:

Phantom 2 Vision

and

3dr Iris+

Now, Iris+ comes with a simple Hero 3 mount and without camera, so if I wanted a decent camera that would put the price of Iris to around 1000 dollars... This would make it ironically more expensive than Vision and close to Vision + but Iris has some more advanced mission planning mode plus follow me mode which I found appealing...

Also, I read about some battery problems with Phantom 2's. I read that it happens quite "often", that the quad just dies mid air for no reason, without any low battery warning or anything like that. This is a bit scary... Is it that widespread? It's not just Vision but any other Phantom 2?

 

[Meta4]

There are thousands of happy Phantom fliers and a very small number of owners who have posted about battery problems.
You can read about this and read about that online and get too scared to buy anything.
Online forums put a huge magnifying glass to anything negative.
You need more than a grain of salt when you assess things based on negative comments online.

 

[un hombre]

I agree, but also reading online (and hearing from DJI dealers) that DJI support is crap and some people wait months for DJI to accept and repair their drones, does not make this option great either.

On the other hand, I find that people praise 3dr and all I can say is that I have had a regular chat with their support, they are very friendly and knowledgeable... So if anything goes wrong, I would be more confident that 3dr deals with the quad malfunctions, than DJI...

I do realise that usually people with problems complain on forums and majority that are happy stay silent, not to mention, that DJI has a much higher customer base and it is natural that there will be more DJI complainers than 3dr.

But still, I have to counterweight all options, hence I am thinking out loud and counting on your feedback and experiences

 

[un hombre]

What would you rather want, Vision with FPV preview on mobile phone or Iris+ with follow me mode and more advanced mission planning?

 

[Meta4]

I don't think you'd find many pilots that have used a Phantom who would prefer the Iris.
Apart from looking like it was made of lego, it's just not in the same class for battery life and having no FPV makes it useless for photography or video.
Follow me is a gimick that sounds great but would be of little use unless you have a big interest in youtube selfie videos and also want to snag trees, buildings and nearby people. The mission planning might be OK for a $10K machine doing photogrammetry but in this class it's just another gimick. The Phantom also has a similar feature but it doesn't get a lot of use.

 

[un hombre]

Well, Iris+ is supposed to have the same class battery life, so I guess it should be a close call...

As for the lack of FPV, I guess you are right that it is a bit useless for the photography, as you don't have the preview of the shot etc...
On the other hand, I have so many uses for follow me mode, and not necessarily narcistic ones.
Drone following me when I am driving on a nice plateau, circling around my car... This must be priceless. On the other hand, I can control Vision while in the car with a shot preview, but I need a driver.

I think I am trying to find a reason not to take DJI, as I am scared as hell of different failures of the machine, not caused by me, and having to deal with DJI support (and possibly being without machine for months if it needs to be sent for repairs). What concerns me is that I do not know how proffessional is the shop I am buying it from, as they are not a listed dealership on DJI web site so I do not know if instead of doing the repairs on warranty, they will just send it o DJI and Vision is no longer produced, which makes it very hard to get nowadays...

 

[Meta4]

If people only concentrated on what might go wrong, no-one would drive a car, swim in the ocean or fly in a plane.
You'll find potential problems with any quadcopter.
I flew a couple of batteries today and had no expectation of failure because like lots of other Phantom pilots I have had about 150 flights with no problems at all.

If you are wanting to video, the Vision is stone age and will not produce good results.
If the Vision isn't produced, the reason is because the 2+ is so much better that no-one would want one these days.

 

[un hombre]

I don't find Vision old tech, it ticks all the boxes in my requirements and I do not need anything more, I do not need a gimbal.

Well, I am not concentraiting on what can go wrong, but I am taking into account a customer support/dealer support when something goes wrong.

It may be just 800 dollars toy for some, but for me it is a piece of equipment that costs substantial amount of money and if something goes wrong, the quad may end up being piece of plastic. I don't know about you but when I buy a car, computer etc, I do take into acount post sales services and support.

Without any doubt even official dealers I spoke with say, that contatcting DJI and their support is just laughable while I only heard positives about 3dr?
If it had been the other way round, I would have bought DJI long time ago.

Maybe I am just overly cautious and I do realise that those problems with Phantom 2's may be just 5% of all sold, but sooner or later something may go wrong and this is when the quality of company comes up...

 

[Meta4]

You are absolutely right Hombre.
The Phantom isn't the right quad for you as you know only too well.
Something might go wrong with it.
It's hard to see why you bother to ask experienced Phantom fliers for their opinions at all.

 

[Lowepg]

What did they say on the IrisPilotsForum when you posed the same question?

I couldnt find it, so I was curious?

 

[HarryT]

It may be just 800 dollars toy for some, but for me it is a piece of equipment that costs substantial amount of money and if something goes wrong, the quad may end up being piece of plastic. I don't know about you but when I buy a car, computer etc, I do take into acount post sales services and support.

The solution is to buy from a "Tier 1" dealer who will provide you with after-sales support and warranty repairs directly, rather than having to go to DJI. There are a number of excellent dealers around.