Phantom 2 flyways

Jaybee said:
ianwood said:
Preventative measures going forward

• Fly ATTI only. Very risky when flying distances / high altitudes. I wouldn't even attempt this mode unless I was flying in close range. I bought the Phantom 2 mainly for filming. The failsafe mode is the dealmaker for users like me.


_____
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Another method is to enable Manual Flight Control.
I have read about several flyaways that were saved by switching to Manual. Theres a video that shows this happening on a s800.

I have my controller configured to manual, and if i want to trigger failsafe RTH, I can turn off the transmitter.

Manual control is much more difficult than Atti, so I recommend you practice on a small micro, then carefully practice on the phantom. Even if you arent comfortable flying manually, in my mind its better to switch to manual and crash it, then to watch it fly off into never-never land forever.
 
jdenkevitz said:
Another method is to enable Manual Flight Control.
I have read about several flyaways that were saved by switching to Manual. Theres a video that shows this happening on a s800.

I have my controller configured to manual, and if i want to trigger failsafe RTH, I can turn off the transmitter.

Manual control is much more difficult than Atti, so I recommend you practice on a small micro, then carefully practice on the phantom. Even if you arent comfortable flying manually, in my mind its better to switch to manual and crash it, then to watch it fly off into never-never land forever.

RTH only works if you are in GPS mode. In manual mode, the Phantom will just land -where it is- if you initiate the failsafe.

"The quad-rotor will automatically land if the fail-safe mode is active, or return home if in GPS mode."

See here: http://wiki.dji.com/en/index.php/Phanto ... _Fail-safe

This is also stated in the user manual:

Failsafe works differently depending on the mode the aircraft is in when Failsafe mode is initiated whether it is in the Ready to Fly or Ready to Fly (non-GPS) mode.

Ready to Fly (non-GPS) ---- Automatic landing
The flight control system will try to keep the aircraft level during descent and landing. Note that the aircraft may be drifting during the descent and landing process.

Ready to Fly ---- Automatic go home and land
The flight control system will automatically control the aircraft to fly back to the home point and land.
 
jdenkevitz said:
Another method is to enable Manual Flight Control.
I have read about several flyaways that were saved by switching to Manual. Theres a video that shows this happening on a s800.
Yep, if I get another Phantom 2 I will most certainly be testing these things over-and-over in a safe pace to figure out how to regain control if the GPS mode gets messed up.
 
Jaybee said:
jdenkevitz said:
Another method is to enable Manual Flight Control.
I have read about several flyaways that were saved by switching to Manual. Theres a video that shows this happening on a s800.

I have my controller configured to manual, and if i want to trigger failsafe RTH, I can turn off the transmitter.

Manual control is much more difficult than Atti, so I recommend you practice on a small micro, then carefully practice on the phantom. Even if you arent comfortable flying manually, in my mind its better to switch to manual and crash it, then to watch it fly off into never-never land forever.

RTH only works if you are in GPS mode. In manual mode, the Phantom will just land -where it is- if you initiate the failsafe.

"The quad-rotor will automatically land if the fail-safe mode is active, or return home if in GPS mode."

See here: http://wiki.dji.com/en/index.php/Phanto ... _Fail-safe

This is also stated in the user manual:

Failsafe works differently depending on the mode the aircraft is in when Failsafe mode is initiated whether it is in the Ready to Fly or Ready to Fly (non-GPS) mode.

Ready to Fly (non-GPS) ---- Automatic landing
The flight control system will try to keep the aircraft level during descent and landing. Note that the aircraft may be drifting during the descent and landing process.

Ready to Fly ---- Automatic go home and land
The flight control system will automatically control the aircraft to fly back to the home point and land.

Im not so sure this is correct for the following reasons:

Turning off the transmitter triggers failsafe. Within Naza, you can set whether failsafe triggers automatic landing, or automatic go home and land.

If it is as you described, and the 'prior mode' (before failsafe was triggered) must be gps, then assigning the lowest s1 position to failsafe would mean that 'RTH and land' would never work. But this is not the case. My understanding was that many users assign that switch as a means to just have the copter return home and land via failsafe. As the switch is in the lowest position, it must travel through the center position (ATTI - non gps) before triggering the failsafe RTH/Land. This would mean the prior mode was non gps.

I assumed (possibly incorrectly), that since i have it set in Naza to RTH, that it would attempt to do so if there was sufficient satellites available.
 
jdenkevitz said:
Im not so sure this is correct for the following reasons:

Turning off the transmitter triggers failsafe. Within Naza, you can set whether failsafe triggers automatic landing, or automatic go home and land.

If it is as you described, and the 'prior mode' (before failsafe was triggered) must be gps, then assigning the lowest s1 position to failsafe would mean that 'RTH and land' would never work. But this is not the case. My understanding was that many users assign that switch as a means to just have the copter return home and land via failsafe. As the switch is in the lowest position, it must travel through the center position (ATTI - non gps) before triggering the failsafe RTH/Land. This would mean the prior mode was non gps.

I assumed (possibly incorrectly), that since i have it set in Naza to RTH, that it would attempt to do so if there was sufficient satellites available.
Right, so you are using NAZA-M mode, that must behave differently in terms of RTH failsafe then?

Can you confirm this with your testing? Your steps, using the NAZA-M mode, sound like a much safer overall environment to operate with. I'd always presumed to RTH the Phantom must be in GPS mode – this is how it transcribes for a user reading the official docs but then again, this is correct as they only pertain to using the standard factory 'Phantom 2' mode.
 
As I understand it, RTH occurs if all these conditions are met:

- the phantom loses signal for x number of seconds or the failsafe mode is triggered (S1 full down in the default Naza M mode config.)
- the phantom has successfully recorded a home location prior to departure
- the phantom is in GPS or ATTI mode and has 6 or more satellites in acquisition
- RTH is set as your failsafe method (default)

I'm assuming manual mode overrides RTH and auto-land. Does anyone know for sure? If so, having failsafe set on S1 seems redundant. Why have two ways to enter failsafe when switching the transmitter off does exactly the same thing? Personally, I think it's better to have the option (god forbid) to enter manual mode should there be a mechanical or GPS issue that causes the P2 to race off.

And remember that Phantom 2 mode is the same as flying GPS mode without course or home lock in Naza M mode. The only difference I know of is you can set a new home location in Phantom 2 mode which I don't think you can do in Naza M mode.
 
Regarding failsafe in manual mode. According to page 9 of the NAZA-M V2 manual (does the P2/P2V have that one?):

With GPS/Compass module and the failsafe requirements are satisfied, in each Control
Mode (including GPS Mode, ATTI. Mode, Manual Mode and IOC Mode), the aircraft will
enter the failsafe Mode.

So when failsafe mode is set for both RTH and Autoland loss of signal should also activate RTH when flying in manual mode. Can anyone confirm this from own experience?
 
Big Ben said:
So when failsafe mode is set for both RTH and Autoland loss of signal should also activate RTH when flying in manual mode. Can anyone confirm this from own experience?

Hopefully not! I think you're right though, RTH will happen in all modes under the conditions I mentioned before. And you can regain control from an RTH in either ATTI or manual mode according to the same Naza M v2 document:

If there is any command change from the receiver, the autopilot system thinks that the receiver is regained. In ATTI. Mode and Manual Mode, it will quit the FailSafe Mode automatically. In GPS Mode, please toggle the control mode switch to the ATTI. Mode and Manual Mode position to regain the control.

So if your P2 is going home to China and not to where you set your home location, switch to ATTI and try to regain control and then back to GPS once you've got it. Manual mode might still be necessary in case the P2 is going home to China because it's simply trying to maintain attitude and can't because of one corner has an issue. Then you're simply going to try to crash land it.
 
buzzflyer sent me my brand new phantom 2 vision today which is a replacement from DJI after i lost mine in the sea after a technical fault
I had to keep on a bit but after I proved there was a fault they agreed to replace it :D so pleased :p
have not flown it yet due to the windy weather we are having but as soon as it is calm I am out there :D

Thanks DJI and thanks buzzflyer excellent service :)
 
chippy jfl said:
buzzflyer sent me my brand new phantom 2 vision today which is a replacement from DJI after i lost mine in the sea after a technical fault
I had to keep on a bit but after I proved there was a fault they agreed to replace it :D so pleased :p
have not flown it yet due to the windy weather we are having but as soon as it is calm I am out there :D

Thanks DJI and thanks buzzflyer excellent service :)

This thread is focused more on the non-vision version of the P2 but while you're here, what was the technical fault that caused your P2V to ditch into the sea?
 
chippy jfl said:
I had to keep on a bit but after I proved there was a fault
How?
 
I just had a scary flight at near dark when I like to fly so to still see the dim sky and lights of P2 are clearly visible, I got far enough away that I could not tell which direction it was facing and all movements I made to determine this seemed to move it further away. I began to panic and switched off the transmitter. I waited and it did not appear to be heading back, if anything it was still moving away. Barely visible over the distant tree tops, I jumped into my car and zig zagged thru the streets to keep it in sight until I came to a large cemetery, and the P2 seemed to be at the far side (approx. 400-500 yds), now it is just about dark, and my heart is pounding, I turned the controller on and tried to rotate to determine its orientation, but the colors seemed to blend together, I then tried to move one direction then another but still could not figure its orientation, or if I even had control, it still appeared to be slowly moving away. Now completely dark, but with full moon I ran across the cemetery wide open toward the P2 until I got to the far side which was a thick line of trees, but it was no longer in the sky, I searched there for the lights in the tree tops, and along the ground-no luck. On the other side of the tree line was a large neighborhood, so I ended up driving up and down the streets there looking for the lights on house and tree tops. On my second pass on one of the streets I noticed flashing lights in my rear view mirror, and behold, some kids were trying to flag me down by waving my P2 around. They said it had scared the hell out of them by landing with those flashing lights in their yard. And by the way, I had printed on the side of the P2 with a permanent pen "Reward if found" with telephone number. They asked about it and I gladly gave them a nice cash reward. When I got home, my wife said the kids parents had called that they had recovered my P2.
Lucky honest people found it for me, unlucky in that I don't know why it did not come home when I switched off the transmitter. It was blinking all green when I took off, no wind and plenty of battery left. I wonder if it is human error or if I had inadvertently switched S1 or S2 to something causing this. I always start with both up. But while running across the cemetery, I noticed S1 had been knocked to the middle position, just don't know when. I would like a very bright horizontal light of some sort that gives a visual of the P2 orientation, any ideas? Also to mention when I came up to the cemetery with the P2 appearing to be on the far side, I wish I had thought to just land it right away, but when you are panicking, running thru a cemetery at night and dollar signs are flashing before your eyes you tend to become un-rational, actually **** near crying.
 
That was too close for comfort. Glad you got it back. It's hard to tell what happened without a video but if I had to guess, I'd say disorientation and panic were probably what caused your incident. It's hard to make good decisions when your watching your wallet fly away.

A couple of recommendations:

  • If you're going to fly the Phantom to the edge of LOS, best to get an FPV and iOSD to be safe. It'll tell you what's actually happening.
  • Get to know home lock. You have to put your Phantom in Naza mode to do this but you'll be glad you did.
  • Give it time. When your Phantom is a tiny dot in the sky, it can seem like it isn't responding or going the other way. That's panic caused by anticipation and our inability to judge approaching objects from very far away. Wait until you can absolutely confirm its motion. FPV will make this easy.
  • Make sure before you take off, you get the rapid flashing green lights confirming home location is recorded.
 
Look up Mini IOSD and check out the videos that show what it does. Since I had one fitted it completely eliminates any doubt about where is home and which way I am flying.

Second anyone who has not switched their machine from Phantom Mode to NAZA mode is throwing away 2 huge benefits for when things start to go out of control. These are HOME LOCK which brings the quad back to the take off point no matter which way it is facing, and FAILSAFE which allows you to activate the RETURN TO HOME feature without turning your transmitter off. I urge people to turn on NAZA mode now. The quad flys exactly the same with the switch turned to GPS mode so your losing nothing and gaining everything.

For those who cannot fit one then I recommend investing in Heli_X simulator. With that you can practice your recovery technique for when its just a dot in the sky.

This is the emergency procedure if you are in NAZA mode

When you lose orientation ensure the quad is in GPS mode.
Activate HOME LOCK
Pull back on the right stick to bring the quad back to the take off point.
When its near enough turn off HOME LOCK and fly normally.

This is the emergency procedure when not in NAZA mode. - which is much harder.

Ensure the quad is in GPS mode so that it will hold its location with no stick input.
We have to turn the quad until its facing away from you.
Hold the right stick hard right for 2 seconds and look at the quad. - Did it move to the right?
If it did pull back on the stick and it will come back to you.
If it didn't turn the quad a small amount and repeat until it moves right.

You have to hold the stick to the right for a couple of seconds in order to get enough movement to see if the quad is moving in the right direction.

You can practice this in the sim and once you become familiar with the procedure its very easy to re-establish orientation.
 
Do you live in the UK would like to chat with you about all the things you mention ?
Could I call you ?
 
chippy jfl said:
Do you live in the UK would like to chat with you about all the things you mention ?
Could I call you ?

Yes I am in the UK. Check your messages
 
ianwood said:
I want to be able to use it anywhere without fearing it will zoom off when somebody starts downloading porn over their WiFi connection. I've been looking at a number of these videos
Oh my. Look what happens when I clip a partial quote, and forgive my sense of humor!
 
Bigbells said:
ianwood said:
I want to be able to use it anywhere without fearing it will zoom off when somebody starts downloading porn over their WiFi connection. I've been looking at a number of these videos
Oh my. Look what happens when I clip a partial quote, and forgive my sense of humor!

That's one of my first posts here! I didn't even own a Phantom yet because I was scared of flyalways. That was only two or so months ago. Now I'm telling other people to calm down. I've watched many videos since then! Many of them were not flyaways.
 
Sigh. My bird is gone.

Been flying quite regularly the past two months. Almost daily. No issues. Flying this morning over a body of water. Filming along the shore. Came back to check battery life, still had two bars, decided to make one more pass. When I got to about 400 ft away, about 40 ft off the ground (coincidentally, flying near a small boat that was passing by in the water), the Phantom began to rotate in flight and fly in a direction that was about 90 deg away from where I was aiming. It continued to do so regardless of what I did with the stick. It seemed like I was controlling speed, but not direction. It's new course took it almost off of LOS. Off-shore. I activated Failsafe. Watched as it ascended and hovered. Felt relieved to see it turn towards home. But, the return flight was not straight. It was more zig-zagging back, using a lot of throttle. I saw it begin to lose altitude and, worried this was from a dying battery, I exited failsafe mode and tried to floor it towards land. Didn't make it. Sank fairly quickly in about 12 feet of water. Couldn't find it.

My question is, this doesn't seem to have been a typical flyaway. Makes me think I had some sort of mechanical failure giving the spinning, the difficulty maintaining a course, and since failsafe mode seemed to work, to some degree.

Any thoughts on what might've happened?

Any thoughts on whether I have a warranty case on something like this?
 
ghinson said:
Sigh. My bird is gone.

My question is, this doesn't seem to have been a typical flyaway. Makes me think I had some sort of mechanical failure giving the spinning, the difficulty maintaining a course, and since failsafe mode seemed to work, to some degree.

Hi mate, sorry to hear about your flyaway. The story sounds kinda familiar to me, I lost my P2 in Jan – there's a detailed account on P.10 of this very forum. I had no response from the controller too etc. although I lost visual, so no idea about it's movements beyond where I last saw it. Killing the TX didn't appear to initiate failsafe and I had 3/4 battery minutes before it disappeared.

I've literally just got a new P2, GoPro, and GSP tracker delivered today. The Zemuse was DOA and is going back to the supplier in the morning :roll:.

I contacted DJI Europe about my flyaway but they dismissed my report as "pilot error or interference" as you might expect. I think as you were over water and clearly near no interference from an urban area you'd have a better chance than me, expect you haven't got the thing to show them which will no doubt be their retort.

I've learned quickly that quad flying is, by all accounts, a tenuous business and it's hard to get back my original excitement from December when I got my original P2, especially as I've already had hardware issues with new kit on day 1!

You got any other details, previous crashes, set up etc? Try and collate all the info you can.

Again sorry to hear this and definitely give DJI a shout, you never know.
 

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