P3A Camera Discovery & Questions

[Fifty7]

Today I accidentally found out that if you hold the screen for a second a blue circle appears and you can drag it up and down to move the gimbal. I've searched this and it seems that most already knew this so enough on that.
On to my questions. I have also searched these but didn't find any definitive answers and I am not a photographer so I don't have much knowledge of this stuff to begin with.

1 - Just started playing with Polar Pro filters. The general rule for manual settings of starting at 100iso and a shutter speed of double the frame rate? Does the go for photos as well as video? (I know the fps don't apply to photos so where do you start?)

2 - This one I'm not sure there is a "right" answer or if it's just preference. What produces a better quality? 2.7k at 30fps or 1080p at 60fps? If this is not real a question of "better" but is preference can you please tell me the differences I should be looking for in the 2 settings?

3 - If the weather is right this weekend I want to try a few videos with different settings (in the same area and in same conditions) to see the difference. When you do that how do you keep track of which video is which? Is there any way of labeling or renaming while you're filming or should I do something like hold up a cue card in front of the screen at the beginning of each video with the settings written on it?

 

[DragonsBack]

1) for photos you really want the shortest shutter speed to minimize blur. So basically opposite rule to video. Unless of course you want blur for some reason - waterfall, sea etc

2) I guess it really depends what you want to do with the shots and what format your eventual output would be. From the nature of your question I'll guess you are a hobbyist so probably posting on YouTube, Vimeo, your own PC etc. unlikely you will need to end up with more than 1080p 30fps for the end product so I'll assume this is the aim and go through each factor...

- 60fps vs 30 fps - as you don't need to output more than 30fps, no need to record higher unless you want to slow the footage down - eg action sports slow mo - in which case 60fps would give the opportunity to slow by 50% without losing the smoothness. I stick to 30fps as I never do action slow mo stuff with the phantom.

- 2.7k vs 1080p - regarding resolution - same as above, if you only need 1080 out then no need to record more. Will also lighten the load on your computer, allow more storage etc. the exception here is that if you think you will need to crop your footage then 2.7k gives some headroom to crop down to 1080 without losing resolution. As an aside- 2.7k is actually an awesome format to watch on the right screen but be aware it is an unusual format and rarely seen online etc. I stick to 1080p almost all the time.

- 2.7k vs 1080p - regarding 'quality' - probably the closest factor to 'quality' is bit rate. 1080p vs 2.7k at the same bitrate will give less compression and hence better quality. Think of bitrate as the 'size of the pipe' - 2.7k has to fit more information down the same pipe so it must be compressed more. Bitrate is fixed on your phantom so 1080 is technically better 'quality'. However, I don't think you'll notice The difference much in practice with 2.7 vs 1080 (4k is another matter).

3) I guess you need some way to identify the takes - good luck with creative options!

My opinion, based on my knowledge. Hope it's of some help...

 

[Fifty7]

1) for photos you really want the shortest shutter speed to minimize blur. So basically opposite rule to video. Unless of course you want blur for some reason - waterfall, sea etc

2) I guess it really depends what you want to do with the shots and what format your eventual output would be. From the nature of your question I'll guess you are a hobbyist so probably posting on YouTube, Vimeo, your own PC etc. unlikely you will need to end up with more than 1080p 30fps for the end product so I'll assume this is the aim and go through each factor...

- 60fps vs 30 fps - as you don't need to output more than 30fps, no need to record higher unless you want to slow the footage down - eg action sports slow mo - in which case 60fps would give the opportunity to slow by 50% without losing the smoothness. I stick to 30fps as I never do action slow mo stuff with the phantom.

- 2.7k vs 1080p - regarding resolution - same as above, if you only need 1080 out then no need to record more. Will also lighten the load on your computer, allow more storage etc. the exception here is that if you think you will need to crop your footage then 2.7k gives some headroom to crop down to 1080 without losing resolution. As an aside- 2.7k is actually an awesome format to watch on the right screen but be aware it is an unusual format and rarely seen online etc. I stick to 1080p almost all the time.

- 2.7k vs 1080p - regarding 'quality' - probably the closest factor to 'quality' is bit rate. 1080p vs 2.7k at the same bitrate will give less compression and hence better quality. Think of bitrate as the 'size of the pipe' - 2.7k has to fit more information down the same pipe so it must be compressed more. Bitrate is fixed on your phantom so 1080 is technically better 'quality'. However, I don't think you'll notice The difference much in practice with 2.7 vs 1080 (4k is another matter).

3) I guess you need some way to identify the takes - good luck with creative options!

My opinion, based on my knowledge. Hope it's of some help...

Thanks for what I'll call the "dumb dumb" answers. It's just what I needed. Easy to understand without many technical terms. I especially like the pipe explanation for bitrate
Just a couple of clarifications:

1 - For photos when you say shortest shutter speed, you mean the fastest, right? I think my photos on Auto are ok (someone who knows what they're looking at would probably be able to give me many reasons why they could be better) and yes, just a hobbyist so everything is mostly for me.

2 - When you talk about cropping down to 1080p? If I'm understanding right this goes to the point that 2.7k cropped footage exported at 1080p should be better than 1080p cropped footage exported at 1080p? I've seen multiple comments about this one but again seems to be preference and I'm not sure that i would see a difference myself.

 

[Trinimon]

I'm coming from a photography background so here's my 2cents worth.

1. I also use PolarPro filters (Cinema Series Vivid) and try to shoot at ISO100 @ 1/60" but I've had problems getting 1/60" on bright days, even with the ND16/PL. I've ordered the regular ND32/PL filter which is not multi-coated and from a couple reviews I read, has a bit of a magenta cast and a little more prone to lens flare. With still shots, higher shutter speed is your friend esp on a vibrating drone on a windy day. If I need to grab a shot, I'll up the ISO to 200 (noise is still pretty good) and that would allow me to double the shutter speed to 1/120 or higher depending on your current setting. If you're already at 1/120 or faster at ISO 100, feel free to take your snapshot. If it's pretty windy out, I'd recommend bumping up to ISO 200 or higher. I wouldn't recommend shooting stills slower than 1/60 for sharper images but that's just me. The rule of thumb for regular SLR shooting for handheld shots is 1/focal length of lens as your minimum shutter speed.

For max editing options, set your bird's camera to 4:3, RAW format, Set Style to Custom (-2,-2,-2), and Color to DLOG. White balance can be left on AWB if you're not sure and can adjusted in post. Your images would look a little flat and bland but it would capture more shadow detail and allow you more flexibility in post where you can add sharpness, saturation, contrast after and maintain more image detail.

2. I should try shooting at 2.7K... I usually just shoot 1080p 24fps @ 1/60" for a more cinematic look. I'll only shoot faster FPS if I want to do slo-mo. Curious as to others' input.

3. You can always stop the recording and start a new one if you don't want to land the bird. Aim the camera at yourself and cue it like raise one hand up for test 1 and both hands on the second as test 2? Just record what settings you used for each. OR like you say, hold up a cue card in front of the camera with the settings and repeat for each test.

 

[DragonsBack]

Thanks for what I'll call the "dumb dumb" answers. It's just what I needed. Easy to understand without many technical terms. I especially like the pipe explanation for bitrate
Just a couple of clarifications:

1 - For photos when you say shortest shutter speed, you mean the fastest, right? I think my photos on Auto are ok (someone who knows what they're looking at would probably be able to give me many reasons why they could be better) and yes, just a hobbyist so everything is mostly for me.

2 - When you talk about cropping down to 1080p? If I'm understanding right this goes to the point that 2.7k cropped footage exported at 1080p should be better than 1080p cropped footage exported at 1080p? I've seen multiple comments about this one but again seems to be preference and I'm not sure that i would see a difference myself.

1. Yes, fastest shutter. As the aperture is fixed on phantom then auto should be the in most situations (with no nd filter). As Trinimon says, you can increase the iso to speed up the shutter if you ever need to.

2. Yes. If you crop 1080 down then you lose some of the original 1080 lines of pixels. But the export has to have 1080 lines (otherwise, erm, it wouldn't be 1080) so your software has to 'fill them in'. Though most software will do this well for a moderate crop, you obviously can't get more detail than what was originally in there. At 2.7k you have 1520 lines of pixels so you can afford to 'throw away' (crop) 440 of the lines whilst still leaving the 1080 lines of original detail in the export. I expect the truth here is actually more complicated as it depends on the quality of the software and settings but hopefully I showed the basic logic.

 

[Fifty7]

I'm coming from a photography background so here's my 2cents worth.

1. I also use PolarPro filters (Cinema Series Vivid)

For max editing options, set your bird's camera to 4:3, RAW format, Set Style to Custom (-2,-2,-2), and Color to DLOG. White balance can be left on AWB if you're not sure and can adjusted in post. Your images would look a little flat and bland but it would capture more shadow detail and allow you more flexibility in post where you can add sharpness, saturation, contrast after and maintain more image detail.

2. I should try shooting at 2.7K... I usually just shoot 1080p 24fps @ 1/60" for a more cinematic look. I'll only shoot faster FPS if I want to do slo-mo. Curious as to others' input.

3. You can always stop the recording and start a new one if you don't want to land the bird. Aim the camera at yourself and cue it like raise one hand up for test 1 and both hands on the second as test 2? Just record what settings you used for each. OR like you say, hold up a cue card in front of the camera with the settings and repeat for each test.

I went with the non polarized lenses just not to have something else that i don't understand and needs to be adjusted properly before flying.

I dont do much editing, again because I don't really know what I'm looking for and what looks good to me can be greatly improved by someone who knows what adjustments to make. I see videos and pictures that I think look amazing and the person who posted is complaining about how bad it looks and I don't get it. Maybe it's bad, maybe they just want assurance and like hearing that it looks good.

Yeah, not looking to land and start over. Will probably stop and start with some kind of notification. I can figure that part out, was just trying to see if there was something within the app first.

Thanks for the help.

1. Yes, fastest shutter. As the aperture is fixed on phantom then auto should be the in most situations (with no nd filter). As Trinimon says, you can increase the iso to speed up the shutter if you ever need to.

2. Yes. If you crop 1080 down then you lose some of the original 1080 lines of pixels. But the export has to have 1080 lines (otherwise, erm, it wouldn't be 1080) so your software has to 'fill them in'. Though most software will do this well for a moderate crop, you obviously can't get more detail than what was originally in there. At 2.7k you have 1520 lines of pixels so you can afford to 'throw away' (crop) 440 of the lines whilst still leaving the 1080 lines of original detail in the export. I expect the truth here is actually more complicated as it depends on the quality of the software and settings but hopefully I showed the basic logic.

Gotcha - Thanks for the help.