Orange Beach, AL "no drone" ordinance

[Slackware]

Look for terms like

Remote Controlled
Remotely Piloted
R/C
Aircraft
Land Use is where you'll most likely find it.

As stated they can't control the airspace but they can make ordinances concerning take-off, landing, and all kinds of "Safety" rules that you would easily violate by simply firing up the motors and hovering.

Our county recently enacted some "County Land Use" ordinances that originally would have made it almost impossible to fly anywhere near County owned land. They asked me for some input and together we drafted a copy that allowed flight in most areas and most conditions and the exclusions made sense (sensitive areas require notification only and you can't fly over the area if there is an event going on or another group has "reserved" the area already (for instance Family Reunion, Birthday party etc).

You can hand launch and catch land to avoid any of those restrictions.

 

[Richard S]

You can hand launch and catch land to avoid any of those restrictions.

Good point. Around the public parking lots and boat launch areas, I get compass errors on the ground due to metal reinforcement in the concrete, so I got in the habit of taking off and landing on the soft cover on my truck bed.

 

[Slackware]

Good point. Around the public parking lots and boat launch areas, I get compass errors on the ground due to metal reinforcement in the concrete, so I got in the habit of taking off and landing on the soft cover on my truck bed.

bet clinton never envisioned astro turf for a soft drone landing.
Looks like you need to fly a flag so you are a legal boat.

 

[Linberg220]

I grew up in OB. My parents still live there, and I can assure you that when I do go over to visit, I will be taking the Phantom along with me. I'm not saying I'm gonna go crazy with it and fly over tourists trying to enjoy themselves, but it will be going out on the boat with me.

I'm going to double check on this also. I haven't heard anything about it, but nor have I inquired about it. My mom works at City Hall, so I'll double check it and see if by chance she can send me a copy of the ordinance.

By chance do you have a name of the person that emailed you back? Sounds like a typical transplant that has moved down and now wants to make sure everyone adheres to not only the Local Laws that he or she and the rest of the transplants made up in their crazy minds, but would also like to point out the Federal Regs to someone who gives them enough courtesy to call ahead to check with them. As if you obviously don't know them yet?

Sorry for the rant, but what a DB! It's those type of people that have ruined what was once a hidden gem in the sand. Thanks in advance!


Sent from my iPhone using PhantomPilots mobile app

 

[Linberg220]

I visit Orange Beach every year and was planning to bring drone with me. Do you know if the ordinance has passed that prohibits drones?

 

[Richard S]

Does anyone know if it's alright to fly down near Ft Morgan ? Headed down soon, would like to bring my P3P along.

I was there recently and flew with no problems.View attachment 77402 View attachment 77402 View attachment 77402

View attachment 77402 View attachment 77402

 

[Richard S]

I visit Orange Beach every year and was planning to bring drone with me. Do you know if the ordinance has passed that prohibits drones?

No ordinance in place. I fly on the beach (not over crowds), in the bays, over the islands, etc on a regular basis.

 

[Linberg220]

The post which begins "I grew up in OB" has my name on it but is not my post.

 

[Mandrake981]

I went to Gulf Islands National Seashore this past weekend, and took my drone out to take photos of Fort Pickens. About 15 minutes into it, I was approached by a park ranger (I was there at like 8:00AM on Sunday) and he said "I will tell you before the cops get here - it's a federal crime to fly a drone in a national park". I played dumb - "Oh, okay, I didn't know that. I'll bring it down then.", he said thanks, and then I apologized (seems to help correct the situation most of the time), and he said "Hey, no sweat. Just remember that it's illegal". I do not think it's technically illegal (that would mean that there was a law on the books about it, and I have searched high and low to find anything listed, and there's nothing).

I contacted Lee Dickinson of the National Park Service (Special Park Services Program Manager), and essentially asked if I could fly there. He emailed me back and said:

Mr. Hobbs

I don't anticipate the National Park Service policy on drones to change anytime soon. That being said, there are provision in the policy for parks to allow the operation of unmanned aerial vehicles with the concurrence of the Washington Office if they make the decision. While it is very unusual for a park to approve/recommend the use of a drone for filming or photography, that decision needs to be made first by the park. I would suggest to start the process you email the superintendent at [email protected].

Sincerely

Lee Dickinson

So, I contacted the park superintendent Dan Brown, and went over what I wanted to do any why:

Hi Daniel - my name is Randall Hobbs. I got your email address from Merle Dickenson (I approached him first about this, as I didn't know who to contact). I am a Florida native (from Pensacola actually), and I would like to be able to take some photos of Fort Pickens and the surrounding bunkers, etc., with the use of a drone (I have a DJI Phantom 4 Pro, which costs an arm and a leg, which I proudly gave up to get one of these things, LOL). Either way, I'd like to spend about half an hour to an hour there (if possible), snapping some pictures. This drone has a 20 megapixel camera, as well as the ability to shoot 4K video (actually it can do both at the same time). I would like to of course do a fairly low flyover around the fort and take some photos to be shared out (because Fort Pickens is something I've seen many times growing up, and I'd like to have some pictures available for people to look at or even take) - this is not a commercial thing, in that the photographs would be free to whomever wants them. I'd gladly share every pixel with you guys as well (because, let's face it, the drone is a powerful camera with 4 props, and can get some amazing shots of the forts and bunkers). I do NOT want to fly inside of Gulf Islands Seashores outside of the forts there (I understand the natural wildlife there that needs to be protected). If allowed to do so, I will make sure I'm 100% compliant in all aspects of the FAA's rules on drones (mine is registered with the FAA as well), and would gladly provide any and all information regarding that - including my flight logs or anything else. I can also arrange to take the photos when there aren't a lot of people (maybe early in the morning on a weekend perhaps), and if there were people, I'd stay away from them (it's just best practice anyway - though this drone is loaded with sensors, which prevent actively prevents me from flying into things anyway).

This drone has given me a new camera angle to work with, as I can get shots that I just cannot on a normal camera, and people able to navigate around and position it where I want it makes it incredible easy to get some of the best shots available. I don't consider myself an expert, but I'm certainly no beginner either. I fly every single day, and have taken some really beautiful photos out here in Panama City, Panama City Beach, and Destin. If you'd like me to send you a couple of the shots I've taken, I'll be glad to do so.

Anyway, I'm hoping we can work together on this and get some great shots of the historic fort (which would - I think - help bolster tourism to the area as well).

Thank you for your consideration...

I received an answer back from him a while later:

Mr. Hobbs,

Thank you for your inquiry regarding the use of drones at Fort Pickens. Gulf Islands National Seashore contains one of the most complete collections of forts and structures relating to the evolution of seacoast defense in the United States, representing a continuum of development from the Spanish colonization of the 18th century through World War II. One of the primary purposes of the park is to afford opportunities for park visitors to understand, appreciate and enjoy these historic resources and values. Through interpretive programs we try to bring history to life by actively presenting stories of important periods of history, helping visitors to visualize and learn about the role of coastal defense to protect mainland communities. Introducing drones, which fly at relatively low levels, into this setting would be contrary to the experience the park provides. The Fort Pickens area also supports vibrant populations of various bird species. Objects of the size, configuration and movement associated with drones could startle, frighten, and/or disturb this wildlife causing disruption of normal feeding, reproduction and nesting behavior. In addition, there is also the potential for these devices to create a hazard to park visitors. Because of this I am unable to authorize your request.

Sincerely,

Daniel R. Brown
Superintendent
Gulf Islands National Seashore
1801 Gulf Breeze Parkway
Gulf Breeze, FL 32563

So, instead of actually reading my email, he sent me a canned response - I had covered all of those same reasons in my email (flying when the park was empty, not flying in Gulf Islands National Seashore, etc.). Needless to say, it's a cookie cutter response and wasn't even considered.

I have since started reaching out to politicians in hopes someone further up the chain could get this issue resolved. I'd be willing to pay a licensing fee or a permit fee to fly there, and would only want to fly over and around the fort to take some photos one time.... I could do so in a short amount of time and be no bother to anyone, but alas, it's going to take getting a few politicians together to make this thing happen.

 

[Richard S]

I went to Gulf Islands National Seashore this past weekend, and took my drone out to take photos of Fort Pickens. About 15 minutes into it, I was approached by a park ranger (I was there at like 8:00AM on Sunday) and he said "I will tell you before the cops get here - it's a federal crime to fly a drone in a national park". I played dumb - "Oh, okay, I didn't know that. I'll bring it down then.", he said thanks, and then I apologized (seems to help correct the situation most of the time), and he said "Hey, no sweat. Just remember that it's illegal". I do not think it's technically illegal (that would mean that there was a law on the books about it, and I have searched high and low to find anything listed, and there's nothing).

I contacted Lee Dickinson of the National Park Service (Special Park Services Program Manager), and essentially asked if I could fly there. He emailed me back and said:

So, I contacted the park superintendent Dan Brown, and went over what I wanted to do any why:


I received an answer back from him a while later:


So, instead of actually reading my email, he sent me a canned response - I had covered all of those same reasons in my email (flying when the park was empty, not flying in Gulf Islands National Seashore, etc.). Needless to say, it's a cookie cutter response and wasn't even considered.

I have since started reaching out to politicians in hopes someone further up the chain could get this issue resolved. I'd be willing to pay a licensing fee or a permit fee to fly there, and would only want to fly over and around the fort to take some photos one time.... I could do so in a short amount of time and be no bother to anyone, but alas, it's going to take getting a few politicians together to make this thing happen.

I did my flight right at Fort Morgan at closing time while the park employees looked on. As you can see from the above photos, I didn't do any low level flying, but the park was empty and gates closed, so I wouldn't have endangered anyone or diminished the atmosphere of the fort tour.

 

[Richard S]

I went to Gulf Islands National Seashore this past weekend, and took my drone out to take photos of Fort Pickens. About 15 minutes into it, I was approached by a park ranger (I was there at like 8:00AM on Sunday) and he said "I will tell you before the cops get here - it's a federal crime to fly a drone in a national park". I played dumb - "Oh, okay, I didn't know that. I'll bring it down then.", he said thanks, and then I apologized (seems to help correct the situation most of the time), and he said "Hey, no sweat. Just remember that it's illegal". I do not think it's technically illegal (that would mean that there was a law on the books about it, and I have searched high and low to find anything listed, and there's nothing).

I contacted Lee Dickinson of the National Park Service (Special Park Services Program Manager), and essentially asked if I could fly there. He emailed me back and said:

So, I contacted the park superintendent Dan Brown, and went over what I wanted to do any why:


I received an answer back from him a while later:


So, instead of actually reading my email, he sent me a canned response - I had covered all of those same reasons in my email (flying when the park was empty, not flying in Gulf Islands National Seashore, etc.). Needless to say, it's a cookie cutter response and wasn't even considered.

I have since started reaching out to politicians in hopes someone further up the chain could get this issue resolved. I'd be willing to pay a licensing fee or a permit fee to fly there, and would only want to fly over and around the fort to take some photos one time.... I could do so in a short amount of time and be no bother to anyone, but alas, it's going to take getting a few politicians together to make this thing happen.

National Park Service, Interior:

36 CFR 2.17

"§ 2.17 Aircraft and air delivery. (a) The following are prohibited: (1) Operating or using aircraft on lands or waters other than at locations designated pursuant to special regulations."

 

[sar104]

I went to Gulf Islands National Seashore this past weekend, and took my drone out to take photos of Fort Pickens. About 15 minutes into it, I was approached by a park ranger (I was there at like 8:00AM on Sunday) and he said "I will tell you before the cops get here - it's a federal crime to fly a drone in a national park". I played dumb - "Oh, okay, I didn't know that. I'll bring it down then.", he said thanks, and then I apologized (seems to help correct the situation most of the time), and he said "Hey, no sweat. Just remember that it's illegal". I do not think it's technically illegal (that would mean that there was a law on the books about it, and I have searched high and low to find anything listed, and there's nothing).

I contacted Lee Dickinson of the National Park Service (Special Park Services Program Manager), and essentially asked if I could fly there. He emailed me back and said:

So, I contacted the park superintendent Dan Brown, and went over what I wanted to do any why:


I received an answer back from him a while later:


So, instead of actually reading my email, he sent me a canned response - I had covered all of those same reasons in my email (flying when the park was empty, not flying in Gulf Islands National Seashore, etc.). Needless to say, it's a cookie cutter response and wasn't even considered.

I have since started reaching out to politicians in hopes someone further up the chain could get this issue resolved. I'd be willing to pay a licensing fee or a permit fee to fly there, and would only want to fly over and around the fort to take some photos one time.... I could do so in a short amount of time and be no bother to anyone, but alas, it's going to take getting a few politicians together to make this thing happen.

This is where the NPS rules derive from, in case you did not find it:

NPS Memo

 

[Mandrake981]

I did my flight right at Fort Morgan at closing time while the park employees looked on. As you can see from the above photos, I didn't do any low level flying, but the park was empty and gates closed, so I wouldn't have endangered anyone or diminished the atmosphere of the fort tour.

Yeah, my flight was at 8:00AM on Sunday morning - there was nobody at the fort whatsoever. I do not know where the park ranger came from, but am assuming he was in one of the buildings behind the fort. The parking lot was empty except for one car, and I couldn't locate anyone on the property whatsoever. If figured it'd be a perfect time to take a few photos....

 

[Mandrake981]

National Park Service, Interior:

36 CFR 2.17

"§ 2.17 Aircraft and air delivery. (a) The following are prohibited: (1) Operating or using aircraft on lands or waters other than at locations designated pursuant to special regulations."

This is referring to manned aircraft - where there would be an engine, etc., (electric or gas powered). They are basically saying aircraft aren't to land on lands or waters owned by the national park service, and that if you do land (or crash) one on national park property, you have to remove all off it (either the entire aircraft, or the pieces of the aircraft body) as quick as possible (unless the removal will cause problems that endanger anyone - then they can tell you to leave it there until it can be removed without being a danger to anyone or anything.

 

[Mandrake981]

This is where the NPS rules derive from, in case you did not find it:

NPS Memo

Yeah, I read that. I emailed the contacts on that page as a matter of fact. All in all, it just seems that they are considering drones to be as dangerous as manned aircraft, and do not want you using an aerial camera to take photos.

 

[sar104]

Yeah, I read that. I emailed the contacts on that page as a matter of fact. All in all, it just seems that they are considering drones to be as dangerous as manned aircraft, and do not want you using an aerial camera to take photos.

There appear to be several motivations for the ban, including a reaction to a few instances of UAVs crashing into geysers and other notable features in National Parks, complaints about noise disturbance to tourists in the parks, and concerns about distubance to wildlife. I haven't heard any significant issues regarding physical safety concerns, but I guess that's possible too in popular NPS locations.

 

[Mandrake981]

There appear to be several motivations for the ban, including a reaction to a few instances of UAVs crashing into geysers and other notable features in National Parks, complaints about noise disturbance to tourists in the parks, and concerns about distubance to wildlife. I haven't heard any significant issues regarding physical safety concerns, but I guess that's possible too in popular NPS locations.

Yeah. Taking the "banning all" approach would be similar to banning all cars because some people choose to drink and drive (and D&D causes a load of deaths every year). It tries to curb the bad by curbing all. I just do not see that as being very conducive. They should instead coming up with some guidelines - such as if you are going to fly a drone in a national park, you're responsible for getting permission first, and once you do, you follow all the rules of the park (such as not swooping in on wildlife, etc.), and that while you're there, someone could easily be there to make sure that you're not misbehaving (since the park rangers are there anyway, it's under their watch either way - if someone is doing something that's endangering other people or wildlife, ground the drone and/or ban them).

I just do not think that banning all drones because of a few people's actions is a good choice...

 

[CactusJackSlade]

You can hand launch and catch land to avoid any of those restrictions.

Mmmmm I don't think so!

 

[Mandrake981]

You can hand launch and catch land to avoid any of those restrictions.

Yeah, this is definitely a no go. I launched from my hand, and I land in my hand. I did so to prevent it from blowing sand around (and since I figured the parking lot would be a bad idea - even though it was empty). The ranger saw it in the air and came over. Had they not cared about the flight, but instead the takeoff and landing, there wouldn't have been any issues (at Fort Pickens anyway)...

 

[Mandrake981]

I did my flight right at Fort Morgan at closing time while the park employees looked on. As you can see from the above photos, I didn't do any low level flying, but the park was empty and gates closed, so I wouldn't have endangered anyone or diminished the atmosphere of the fort tour.

I'm going to try to get over there this weekend. Then I'll email Dan Brown and Lee Dickinson back to let them know that they're the laughing stock - that it's pretty sad that they're that afraid of drones that they'll completely ban them, while other parks have no problem with them whatsoever.