My P2V Video Workflow and Sample Footage

[disjecta]

One of the biggest disadvantages to working with footage from cameras such as the FC200 is that they write to a highly compressed codec. The minute you do anything to that file in your editing program, the quality dramatically degrades.

I wanted to share my process with those that are interested in doing some editing and preserving maximum quality throughout the pipeline.

In order to avoid any further degradation of the original footage (and this really pertains to those using more advanced editing software like FCP, Avid or Premiere, etc.), I save it immediately to a more robust format. For me, on Windows, that means an uncompressed AVI. On a Mac, you'd probably save as ProRes. There are other shareware programs that will do this kind of conversion but you'd have to Google them.

I do this file conversion before I even change the frame rate or anything else. After I reimport my AVI file, I reinterpret my 30fps to 24fps (just because I like the feel of that frame rate). I then do some basic editing, trimming the footage to what I want to use and stabilize it using the Warp Stabilizer. Next I can start color correcting or applying effects or whatever.

Below is some sample footage that went through the process described above. I did a levels adjustment to boost the blacks a little and that was pretty much it for color correction. Ironically, this does not look anyway as good as the original

This maybe too much effort and time for many of you but it's my own workflow and it helps to keep the quality optimal.

As an additional tip for shooting video, I would recommend taking the camera off auto white balance and choosing the "cloud" icon for daylight shots. This way, all your shots from the same location will have consistent color. This is especially important if you are shooting jpegs for a panorama photograph.

http://youtu.be/aKD0u6rRdU8

 

[themosttoys]

Good post. Good tips (especially the converting to avi and the white balance tips).

Great work on the video! Good job.

Thanks for sharing.

 

[Shrimpfarmer]

Very interesting post, thanks for sharing your workflow. I am going to try the same and see how I get on. Like the music choice for your video. I hear good things about the warp stabiliser but its not available for FCPX.

 

[iResq]

Was that Edward Scissor Hands?

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[DocMonkey]

Thanks for the tips.

I just downloaded the trial version of FCP 10.1, and it really feels like a slightly better version of iMovie...
The stabilizer seems to warp my footage too...not liking it so far...more to come.

Your barn video looks great, other than color adjustment, what else did you do to this clip? Slow frame rate? Stabilize?
thanks!

 

[iResq]

I can then render it out as a .mov for upload to YouTube or Vimeo. Avoid resaving to the mp4 format if you can.

A helpful high level workflow description. I'm puzzled by this quoted part though.

What downside do you to see with using a mp4 container vs a mov container? They are after all merely containers and the codecs that they wrap can yield widely varying video quality depending upon render settings.

I think you are correct. I use H.264 codec so the container would not make any difference except for what system could play it back.

 

[disjecta]

Thanks. I would urge you to play with the settings for any stabilizing software. It is not always optimal at the default settings.

The video I posted underwent the same process I describe in my first post:
Convert to uncompressed AVI
Import AVI
Interpret original 30fps to 24fps
Edit on a 24fps timeline
Trim footage to what I want to use
Apply Warp Stabilizer
Apply levels correction
Apply a little unsharp mask
Apply letterbox
Render out to .mov
Done

 

[disjecta]

The reason why it's not wise to resave as an mp4 is because when you do that, it looks at the information and throws a lot of it out all over again. It will average the pixels in a scene and create blocks instead of detail in order to keep the size of the file small. It's already done this with the original and it will further average certain areas of your newly edited footage compromising sharpness and detail until certain parts of your scene will just be blobs. If you save as a .mov with h.264 compression it will be much less damaging to your file and most of the detail will be saved. Also, if you upload to YouTube there's yet another level of degradation.

It gets really complicated trying to describe this process. It's like trying to describe everything you do to drive a car. I hope what I've said makes sense. There is plenty of information on the web about why mp4 is not a good idea to edit.

 

[Sledge]

Thanks. I would urge you to play with the settings for any stabilizing software. It is not always optimal at the default settings.

I bought the rights to use the music a while back from a Website called Premium Beat so it's not a movie soundtrack but it reminded me of one.

The video I posted underwent the same process I describe in my first post:
Convert to uncompressed AVI
Import AVI
Interpret original 30fps to 24fps
Edit on a 24fps timeline
Trim footage to what I want to use
Apply Warp Stabilizer
Apply levels correction
Apply a little unsharp mask
Apply letterbox
Render out to .mov
Done

Thanks for sharing! When I get my dry Dronexpert gimbal this week and assuming it gets over zero degrees, i am going to test this workflow. I had been doing the lens correction first in Photoshop, then warp stabilizer (in AE) ...I see you do warp first, do u think it matters?

 

[Sledge]

Thanks. I would urge you to play with the settings for any stabilizing software. It is not always optimal at the default settings.

I bought the rights to use the music a while back from a Website called Premium Beat so it's not a movie soundtrack but it reminded me of one.

The video I posted underwent the same process I describe in my first post:
Convert to uncompressed AVI
Import AVI
Interpret original 30fps to 24fps
Edit on a 24fps timeline
Trim footage to what I want to use
Apply Warp Stabilizer
Apply levels correction
Apply a little unsharp mask
Apply letterbox
Render out to .mov
Done

Also, how exactly do interpret the 30 to 24 inter? Thanks in advance!

 

[disjecta]

Yes, you are correct, I am confusing the codec with the container. So I stand corrected and will make that adjustment in my first post.

Thank you.

 

[disjecta]

In Premiere Pro you right click on the file and under the modify dropdown menu, interpret footage is an option.

I don't know if it really matters when you choose to stabilize in the workflow. I just like working with smooth footage upfront so it works for me.

 

[iResq]

Would stabilization benefit from higher frame rates?

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[jimre]

I find that Warp Stabilizer *definitely* benefits from applying lens-correction first. My first step is to apply the DJI Lens Profile to the P2V footage in Photoshop, then immediately save it in an un-compressed format. Then bring this un-compressed, de-fisheyed footage into AE or Premiere Pro, and run Warp Stabilizer on it.

Doing the de-fish first results in much less of the "flexy bowing effect" being generated by Warp. I think this is different from the "jello" that people sometimes talk about (caused by image motion with a CMOS sensor). I'm pretty sure this "bowing" is caused by fisheye footage. When Warp is calculating how to compensate for movement - it assumes all parts of the image are moving at the same speed. That's true with a rectilinear image, but with fisheye the outer parts of the image are actually moving faster than the center. Hence the "flexy bowing effect". So make your images rectilinear first.

 

[Shrimpfarmer]

I find that Warp Stabilizer *definitely* benefits from applying lens-correction first. My first step is to apply the DJI Lens Profile to the P2V footage in Photoshop, then immediately save it in an un-compressed format. Then bring this un-compressed, de-fisheyed footage into AE or Premiere Pro, and run Warp Stabilizer on it.

Doing the de-fish first results in much less of the "flexy bowing effect" being generated by Warp. I think this is different from the "jello" that people sometimes talk about (caused by image motion with a CMOS sensor). I'm pretty sure this "bowing" is caused by fisheye footage. When Warp is calculating how to compensate for movement - it assumes all parts of the image are moving at the same speed. That's true with a rectilinear image, but with fisheye the outer parts of the image are actually moving faster than the center. Hence the "flexy bowing effect". So make your images rectilinear first.

This makes sense. I am certainly going to be trying that. Thanks.

 

[iResq]

Agreed.

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[Klaus]

Thanks. I would urge you to play with the settings for any stabilizing software. It is not always optimal at the default settings.

The video I posted underwent the same process I describe in my first post:
Convert to uncompressed AVI
Import AVI
Interpret original 30fps to 24fps
Edit on a 24fps timeline
Trim footage to what I want to use
Apply Warp Stabilizer
Apply levels correction
Apply a little unsharp mask
Apply letterbox
Render out to .mov
Done

Maybe it's just me, I'm new to the whole Video rendering stuff :roll:
But instead of interpreting all the video clips your are going to use, wouldn't it be the same, if you just render to a 24fps output?
Also don't you get a smoother video with 30fps compared to 24fps?
How do you apply the letterbox format? Is it just a cropping or are there a another way to do it.
I'm asking because I have tried to rotate some footage to get it horizontal, but then I have to up-scaled it afterwards to get rid of the black edges. So maybe applying the letterbox format is a better way.

Thanks

 

[Shrimpfarmer]

Thanks. I would urge you to play with the settings for any stabilizing software. It is not always optimal at the default settings.

The video I posted underwent the same process I describe in my first post:
Convert to uncompressed AVI
Import AVI
Interpret original 30fps to 24fps
Edit on a 24fps timeline
Trim footage to what I want to use
Apply Warp Stabilizer
Apply levels correction
Apply a little unsharp mask
Apply letterbox
Render out to .mov
Done

Maybe it's just me, I'm new to the whole Video rendering stuff :roll:
But instead of interpreting all the video clips your are going to use, wouldn't it be the same, if you just render to a 24fps output?
Also don't you get a smoother video with 30fps compared to 24fps?
How do you apply the letterbox format? Is it just a cropping or are there a another way to do it.
I'm asking because I have tried to rotate some footage to get it horizontal, but then I have to up-scaled it afterwards to get rid of the black edges. So maybe applying the letterbox format is a better way.

Thanks

Hi Klaus

If you convert a high frame rate to a low frame rate, when its played back in the editor its effectively in slow motion, even though its playing at full speed (i.e. the new 24fps rate) If its a relatively low drop in FPS, in the example above its only 6fps slower then the playback will just have a more graceful appearance.

Now if you shoot at 100 fps and bring that down to 24 fps then it becomes an ultra slow mo. You can always speed up a clip to get it back to its normal speed. I hope thats right as its only now I have my Gopro that I have a camera that allows me to shoot at different fps.

 

[Klaus]

Hi Klaus

If you convert a high frame rate to a low frame rate, when its played back in the editor its effectively in slow motion, even though its playing at full speed (i.e. the new 24fps rate) If its a relatively low drop in FPS, in the example above its only 6fps slower then the playback will just have a more graceful appearance.

Now if you shoot at 100 fps and bring that down to 24 fps then it becomes an ultra slow mo. You can always speed up a clip to get it back to its normal speed. I hope thats right as its only now I have my Gopro that I have a camera that allows me to shoot at different fps.

Hi Schrimpy

Yes but I was thinking keeping the timeline in 30fps and then in the output rendering make it 24fps wouldn't that give the same result.
I'm not sure how it converts from 30fps to 24fps? Is it just slowed down in tempo or is it actually cutting frames?
And I don't really understand why you want to go down form 30 to 24fps unless of course you will make it a little slower, but if the "original" tempo are ok why slow it down?
A s I see it (maybe I'm wrong) it's a little the same as resolution, higher resolution - more or better details. So I would think higher Fps would be better and smoother movements?
Am I totally wrong here?

 

[Shrimpfarmer]

Hi Klaus

If you convert a high frame rate to a low frame rate, when its played back in the editor its effectively in slow motion, even though its playing at full speed (i.e. the new 24fps rate) If its a relatively low drop in FPS, in the example above its only 6fps slower then the playback will just have a more graceful appearance.

Now if you shoot at 100 fps and bring that down to 24 fps then it becomes an ultra slow mo. You can always speed up a clip to get it back to its normal speed. I hope thats right as its only now I have my Gopro that I have a camera that allows me to shoot at different fps.

Hi Schrimpy

Yes but I was thinking keeping the timeline in 30fps and then in the output rendering make it 24fps wouldn't that give the same result.
I'm not sure how it converts from 30fps to 24fps? Is it just slowed down in tempo or is it actually cutting frames?
And I don't really understand why you want to go down form 30 to 24fps unless of course you will make it a little slower, but if the "original" tempo are ok why slow it down?
A s I see it (maybe I'm wrong) it's a little the same as resolution, higher resolution - more or better details. So I would think higher Fps would be better and smoother movements?
Am I totally wrong here?

When you slow down 30 to 24 it your not losing any frames. They will all be there but just take longer to play so it then appears slow. The reason for doing this would be to make use of the slow motion effect. So in the editor I could speed up some clips to achieve a transition from fast to slow to fast. If you make the change after you have finished editing the whole film would be slow.

I have not finalised my workflow yet but I will probably shoot at a high frame rate so that I can get smooth slow motion if I need it.