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Motors turning wrong way after replacing with T-motor?

Discussion in 'Phantom 1 Help' started by Scalpel78, Jul 8, 2013.

  1. Scalpel78

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    Hi guys, I just replaced my stock motors with T-motor engines.

    When I started it up I checked that two-and-two motors turn the same way, and was happy about that. Then - I went outside and started it up... It started spinning counter-clockwise and I lost control over it.

    Now I'm trying to figure out what happened.

    When I point the nose away from me I noticed that all motors turn the opposite way than described in the picture below. While M1 and M2 turn against each other in the fron of the quad in the drawing, mine turn away from each other.

    [​IMG]

    Could that be the reason why it was spinning out of control? I just wanted to check with you guys before opening it up and resoldering all the motors.
     
  2. Gizmo3000

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    Well, you either did one of two things
    -hopefully you merely put the top shell of your phantom on the wrong way, (90 degrees one way or the other), resulting in you accidentally installing all the props on the wrong way
    -or you soldered all your motors in the wrong way?
     
  3. Scalpel78

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    Aha! I see that the DJI sticker on the top of the drone is 90 degrees wrong! Comparing to some pictures I have of it from before I see that I have put it on the wrong way.

    I'lll turn it and see what happens. Super tip!
     
  4. Scalpel78

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    Actually, after turning the top part 90 degress I see that the motors are all still turning in the opposite direction than in the picture. Could someone check to see which ways yours go?
     
  5. Scalpel78

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    I just tried it outside, and it wouldn't lift off. The motors are spinning at normal speed, but I think they force the quad downwards instead.

    Do I need to resolder all the motors, or will it help if I turn the props upside down (he said hopingly...)
     
  6. Driffill

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    I'd say the motors are (wired) the wrong way, if the blades are on the wrong spots, the quad will just be glued to the ground, and in your case, with the motors wired in the incorrect direction, if you put the blades on the correctly spinning motors, it may fly, but all the algorithms for automated flight (inc the stabilisers for hovering and facing the same way constantly) are based on the motors spinning the way the naza is set, if its different, when you take off, it'll "twist" (sorry, I don't understand helicopter talk, yaw roll etc) and in an effort to correct the "twist" it will actually make it worse and get faster!

    Not that I've done it, but I believe to change to direction of the motor, you only need to swap two wires on the ESC. Any two should do it! (That tells me the motors could be wired in a "delta" configuration, but that's enough geek talk from me).

    Hopefully you'll be back up in the air soon :)
     
  7. Gizmo3000

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    Something isn't making sense here.

    -if you had first put the top on wrong, then it would have mislead you into putting the props on the wrong way and the Phantom would want to fly downward
    -if you then put the top on the correct way, then the props would all be reversed (if you followed the directions in the plastic) and it would want to fly up

    So one configuration should have worked in at least making the craft want to go upwards.
     
  8. martcerv

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    Did you take note of motor rotation while installing the motors, to me it sounds lime you just soldered them in and hoped to get lucky 4 out of 4 times. The odds of that install method working are very bad and you really need to take more care when doing such things.

    To fix this you will need to take it apart again, take the props off and check the rotation of each motor compared to the rotation marks on the shell. Any motors spinning the wrong way you need to change any 2 of the 3 wires and this will change their rotation. Do a test without props then to make sure all are spinning the correct way, re fit the shell making sure it is properly orientated and insert the props.

    I highly recommend anyone making any mods to properly research how to do things properly before attempting anything, blind luck isnt the way to do things. Read the manuals and test all parts before installing props and flying, if you dont then you can destroy all your gear or even worse hurt someone so take a bit more care with such things.
     
  9. Scalpel78

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    Gizmo3000, on the first run it did lift off, but was spinning and not controllable. So in that configuration the engines turned the wrong way (due to bad wiring), and rotors were placed in wrong position (due to top turned 90 degrees). In that case two wrongs almost made a right ;)

    Martcerv, since the wires on the T-Motors are unmarked I wired them on in the same order as the previous motors. Based on there being no manual, no marking and not finding any description on the web other than "if wrong just replace two of three wires" I went with putting them in the same order. After soldering them on I checked to see if any where turning the wrong way. Since two-and-two turned the same way I thought they were correct - it didn't occur that all of them were wrong.

    I'll undo all the screws, redo the soldering, test and hopefully get it up and flying tonight.
     
  10. boat chaser

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    I have some t-motor anti gravity motors on the way, are they directional motors or is the direction determined by the esc's. I noticed in the youtube install video that there seems to be one cable (black one) that is soldered to the esc in the same place as the others. I'm guessing the other spots on the esc control the direction. Making it relatively easy to get the right direction.

    http://youtu.be/egAj_smEyC4
     
  11. Scalpel78

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    Hi guys, engines have now been resoldered, and it looks as though they are turning the right way.

    Quick question - should I do anything in the NazaM Assistant software after changing the motors? Does it need any new calibrations etc?
     
  12. Scalpel78

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    Puhh! I got it up and flying!

    It was a lot harder to control now than before. Even in GPS mode it drifted to the sides, and also changed altitude. I had a hard time just trying to get it to hover. The engines would rev up now and again shooting the quad into the air. It felt very wobbly and I didn't feel I really had control.

    Just for the record, I also changed the propellers to stiffer carbon ones, but I can't imagine it would cause this kind of instability.

    Is this a calibration issue?
     
  13. jumanoc

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    Verify that you right assembled the top shell aligned in front stripes direction.

    And just for the record:
    Make one change at a time for detect where the fault is. I suggest to use the old stock props and test it. If it keeps woobling is also recommended and advanced calibratioin and compass calibration, specially after open shell.
     
  14. FangsCPO

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    I read on this forum somewhere that you may need to do some adjustments to your gains. Someone even posted what the settings should be here. Do a search for "Upgrade Motor" and that info should apply within this forum.

    I know I ordered the T-Motor MN2214-11 K920 and that one is a direct install, no adjustments required. I think a few guys purchased the K800 version and that one definitely needs some adjustments from what I read. Good Luck!
     
  15. Scalpel78

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    Thanks for the help guys. I finally got it flying in a controlled manor again.

    I changed back to the previous props, tightened the screws on the new motors (some were a little loose) and did an Advanced Calibration. Works just fine now :)
     
  16. martcerv

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    I think all tmotors have just the 3 black cables, you need to take note of each motors rotation and make sure its spinning the correct way. When I did mine I noted that even the cables connecting to the esc werent the same so if you connected the same 3 cables in the same order coming from the motor the rotation wasnt the same in each case. So the only thing you can do is connect them do a test spin and if its wrong change 2 of the 3 wires.

    @ Scalpel which carbon props were you using? Not all props will be the same and changing these may need changes in gains and also ensure they are well balanced. Some are not the correct profile either so avoid them and cheap carbon props made badly will make flying much worse then the stock props. I have tried a few sets of props and my first attempt with some well buikt props carbon 8x5 graupner clones were a fail due to much less lift. These are very solid and stiff plus I balanced then well but the loss in lift made then useless. I tried some 8045 carbon props, not as solid as the others much lighter with less material and a little more flex but well balanced and work great. Fly like the stock props with the benefits or carbon but also the negatives were they break easily if hitting a branch. I have since damaged my first set of these but will get some more and wont do any agressive fpv flying with carbon props on again. They were great for video and after balancing gave me very good results and were a but more responsive in flight but I will try the stocks for a little and see if they hurt that much.
     
  17. Scalpel78

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    @martcerv, I used these - http://www.foxtechfpv.com/1038-cf-prope ... -1067.html
    The quality actually seemed quite poor. The paintlayer was flaking off even before I put them on the quad.

    I'm a bit afraid the stock props are too flexible for the new t-motors. I notice that if I give it full throttle the quad shakes pretty bad, and I worry the props might snap if I rev them too brutally.

    Can anyone recommend good props for the T-Motor 2214 kv920? I neeed some who fit together with the prop guards.
     
  18. Gizmo3000

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    I've been quite pleased with the performance of my APC 8 x 3.8 slo fly props.
    harder than the stock DJI props, but have a slight bit of flex in them, and won't shred on impact.
     
  19. Scalpel78

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    Does the term "slow flyer" mean anything special? Has anyone tried wooden props?
     
  20. FangsCPO

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    I would imagine that if it's shaking too much it might just be that you need to have a motor balanced or the props balanced. What you can try is, take off all the props, put the quadcopter on a table and give it full throttle. If it vibrates across the table, then your motors need balancing.