Issues with take off

[teccer]

A tip for those that are having a problem with the phantom tipping forwards on take-off, I also had the same problem mainly because of camera/gimbal etc making the quad nose heavy just a simple thing to do, I'm surprised that nobody has thought of it before,
all I've done is to fit 2 pieces of neoprene 3mm (cut from an old wet suit, I suppose any peice of rubber will do) and superglued to the bottom of the 2 front rubbers on the legs tipping the phantom so slightly backwards, I've had 5 flights today with it and every time using only the left stick TH it climbs absolutely vertically some may say I'm upsetting something inside as it's setting itself up but all I can say after 5 flights all is working perfect .

at least try it, I won't cost you anything to do it

ray

 

[gianni_BT]

At the moment I solved the problem(10 successfull take off without problems) using this procedure:
-in GPS mode, wait initialization to complete, up to satellite detection an Home point recording.
-start motors and wait few seconds propellers to equalize(5 to 10 sec)
-switch in ATTI mode
-pull trottle not too gently and not full trottle
-when take off is complete, switch to GPS mode

All the time I tried this procedure I had a SJ4000 camera mounted(no gimbal).

 

[teccer]

At the moment I solved the problem(10 successfull take off without problems) using this procedure:
-in GPS mode, wait initialization to complete, up to satellite detection an Home point recording.
-start motors and wait few seconds propellers to equalize(5 to 10 sec)
-switch in ATTI mode
-pull trottle not too gently and not full trottle
-when take off is complete, switch to GPS mode

All the time I tried this procedure I had a SJ4000 camera mounted(no gimbal).

Hi gianni_BT
I've just tried your method had 4 takeoffs and mine still wanted to fly forwards a foot or two before straightning up so then I put my spacers back on the front of the legs and then it went straight up off takeoff point, so I don't know what I was doing different to you but thanks for your input to this dilemma

 

[gianni_BT]

Hi gianni_BT
I've just tried your method had 4 takeoffs and mine still wanted to fly forwards a foot or two before straightning up so then I put my spacers back on the front of the legs and then it went straight up off takeoff point, so I don't know what I was doing different to you but thanks for your input to this dilemma

Maybe some difference in transmitter calibration. I do not think there are differencies in the Naza set-up, unless you voluntary made some change to the stock values.
Anyway if the spacers solution work, why not to use it? I took note of it in case in future the method I found gives problems.
Thanks for your feedback.
One more question: are you flying with stock batteries or are you using something else?
This qwestion of compatible batteries is another good thread to open.

 

[teccer]

Maybe some difference in transmitter calibration. I do not think there are differences in the Naza set-up, unless you voluntary made some change to the stock values.
Anyway if the spacers solution work, why not to use it? I took note of it in case in future the method I found gives problems.
Thanks for your feedback.
One more question: are you flying with stock batteries or are you using something else?
This question of compatible batteries is another good thread to open.

Hi again,

I've not made any changes to the naza set-up nor any of the gains, any changes I've made in the past with the gains have all been reset back to default.

yes I think I'll stick with my little bit of rubber, (now changed to hard rubber) because the neoprene got compressed with the phantom standing on them while it was packed away .

I've got 7 lipos 1 phantom 2200mah, 2 turnigy 2200mah, 2 zippy 2200mah, 1 giant power 2800mah, (fit really well but wires go in first.
and 1 black magic 3000mah again wire in first and the door shuts without hardly touching the back of the lipo.

the shortest time I get is with the zippys, the turnigy and the phantom run about 1.1/2 minutes more than the zippy, the giant power is just a tad more than 2 minutes than the turnigy/phantom, I haven't got the black magic up to full power yet, (not really running it down completely yet) another 4-5 flights with it then I see how much more time I get with it

 

[gianni_BT]

Hi again,

I've got 7 lipos 1 phantom 2200mah, 2 turnigy 2200mah, 2 zippy 2200mah, 1 giant power 2800mah, (fit really well but wires go in first.
and 1 black magic 3000mah again wire in first and the door shuts without hardly touching the back of the lipo.

the shortest time I get is with the zippys, the turnigy and the phantom run about 1.1/2 minutes more than the zippy, the giant power is just a tad more than 2 minutes than the turnigy/phantom, I haven't got the black magic up to full power yet, (not really running it down completely yet) another 4-5 flights with it then I see how much more time I get with it

For the moment I use 3 stock 2200mah batteries and I bought 2 black magic 2700mah: I did not bought the 3000mah due to many issues in delivery(at least from Banggood).
I have a question: I read that it is possible to gain some flight time by adjusting the default parameters of the level 1&2 low voltage warning in Naza assistant: did you made some adjustment according to the different types of batteries you use? And, if not, which values are you using?
I do not fully understand the data shown in "No Load" and "Loaded" fields and, probably due to my poor english, the instruction in the help do not clarify to me the meanings.
Literally following the instructions, I actually insert 11,6V(1V less than the fully charged value) in the first level and 11.1V in the second level(the nominal rate). I left the default in the "Loss" field.
What do you think.

Thanks for your time.

 

[teccer]

For the moment I use 3 stock 2200mah batteries and I bought 2 black magic 2700mah: I did not bought the 3000mah due to many issues in delivery(at least from Banggood).
I have a question: I read that it is possible to gain some flight time by adjusting the default parameters of the level 1&2 low voltage warning in Naza assistant: did you made some adjustment according to the different types of batteries you use? And, if not, which values are you using?
I do not fully understand the data shown in "No Load" and "Loaded" fields and, probably due to my poor english, the instruction in the help do not clarify to me the meanings.
Literally following the instructions, I actually insert 11,6V(1V less than the fully charged value) in the first level and 11.1V in the second level(the nominal rate). I left the default in the "Loss" field.
What do you think.

Thanks for your time.

no problem.
I haven't changed the low voltage although some have suggested to do it but my thinking is that I'd like to land with a reading of 11.1v rather than any lower, I'm sure the lipos will last a lot longer that way, and like you I'm not sure about load/no load so have left that alone, I may in the future lower that figure but I'll see how I'm getting on with my bigger mAh lipos.
if you do not have a gimbal on then you should get longer times than me, for the first 6 months I only had the foxtech horyzon fitted into the cam holder that came with the v1.1.1 and because it was so light I never had any problems with the quad being nose heavy, it's only since I fitted the gimbal (205gms) that I first encountered the quad tipping on takeoff, (now solved)

lighter phantom

now with gimbal 205 gms heavier but much better results with video, see

 

[gianni_BT]

Up to now I only have a SJ4000 camera in the stock fixed support: this low weight is probably the reason of the different experiences we have with the take-off.
The logical evolution is to go to a gimbal and , maibe, a better quality camera, but , for the moment , I do not plan this upgrade.
About the battery, it will take not less than a couple of weeks to receive my 2700mah from Banggood, then I will let you know the results.
I will also check with some friends more experienced than me the meaning of the low voltage settings in Phantom. In case of different suggestions compared with the standard parameters, I will let you know.

 

[teccer]

Up to now I only have a SJ4000 camera in the stock fixed support: this low weight is probably the reason of the different experiences we have with the take-off.
The logical evolution is to go to a gimbal and , maibe, a better quality camera, but , for the moment , I do not plan this upgrade.
About the battery, it will take not less than a couple of weeks to receive my 2700mah from Banggood, then I will let you know the results.
I will also check with some friends more experienced than me the meaning of the low voltage settings in Phantom. In case of different suggestions compared with the standard parameters, I will let you know.

ok please let me know how you get on with the new lipo.
ray

 

[gianni_BT]

ok please let me know how you get on with the new lipo.
ray

Received the 2 BlackMagic 2700mah from Banggood,charged at stock voltage(3.8V/cell) and very well balanced between cells.
The flight time from battery connection to 15 sec. after the first low voltage red flashing is 13min 15 sec.
With stock 2200mah battery is 9min 50 sec. for the same conditions.
I fly with prop guards and an SJ4000 camera mounted on the fixed stock camera holder.
Low voltage settings (loaded) are 10.68V and 10.38V.
I did not try to reach the self landing level, so I presume to have additional 30 to 40 seconds of flight.
The 2 batteries behaviour is a little bit different: with the same voltage discharge setting, one requires 2614ma to return "fully loaded" while the other becomes "fully loaded" with 2389ma.
Obviously these values are given by the same battery charger with balance charge at 1500mah.
The battery can fit the stock battery compartment if you insert wires first.
I prefer to cut a little bit the cover (on both left and right sides) and just a little bit the frame(only on the left side) in order to have wires outside(both main power and balance cable). The reason to have the balance cable outside is to connect a programmable set low voltage alarm.
Having outside the main power cable allows to reduce the movement of the power cable connected to the quad flighy controller and this should increase the lifetime of the cable itself.

 

[teccer]

you must be well pleased with your results, I see you got the 2700mAh lipos, I've got 2 but my last lipo is a 3000 mAh and get another 2 minutes with that so according to that you might even get 15 minute flights with a 3000.
as I've got a gimbal and fpv gear adding to my weight that must account for why I only get 10 minutes, AUW is about 1235 grms, what is your weight including lipo?.
up till now I have been shoving the lipo in wires first but I see your point, it's not doing the wires a lot of good so today I'll be doing the same as you with the wire connections outside, I know it will make things a lot easier because sometimes it takes time to get the lipo in wire first, forget what it looks like it works
thanks for your reply
ray

 

[gianni_BT]

you must be well pleased with your results, I see you got the 2700mAh lipos, I've got 2 but my last lipo is a 3000 mAh and get another 2 minutes with that so according to that you might even get 15 minute flights with a 3000.
as I've got a gimbal and fpv gear adding to my weight that must account for why I only get 10 minutes, AUW is about 1235 grms, what is your weight including lipo?.
up till now I have been shoving the lipo in wires first but I see your point, it's not doing the wires a lot of good so today I'll be doing the same as you with the wire connections outside, I know it will make things a lot easier because sometimes it takes time to get the lipo in wire first, forget what it looks like it works
thanks for your reply
ray

About the weight I will let you know ASAP.
To have the wires outside(at least the balance cable) is a must if you want to add a low voltage alarm buzzer. I bought a settable threshold alarm buzzer from Banggood and I found it very usefull. I set the alarm at 3.7V/cell and I can hear the buzzer even at a distance of 130/150 mt and more (in a quiet environment): this gives me an early warning with 2.5 / 3 minutes of remaining fly time, so I have all the time to quietly go back home. I tried with the alarm setting at 3.6V/cell, but it is really too close to the first level setting in Naza, so the warning is not an "early warning". The voltage alarm buzzer is also useful to test the battery voltage before starting or at the end of the loading process, so I find it very useful. The size and weight is very small and can be easily mounted of the front of the battery cover using Velcro.
Do you mind to give me the low voltage settings (loaded) you have done in the Naza assistant?

 

[SouthernPhantom]

Not quite sure if this applies to the problems being mentioned here. But I've never had a bad auto takeoff with my P3, even though some users in other threads prefer not to use it. It's always super-smooth. The unit rises to three feet and stabilizes perfectly still, then I take it to about 30 feet to make sure it's still stable. And then up we go "to where no man has gone before!"

I do occasional compass calibrations, and even fewer cold IMU calibrations at reasonable but not obsessive intervals. And everything is usually glass smooth!

 

[teccer]

Not quite sure if this applies to the problems being mentioned here. But I've never had a bad auto takeoff with my P3, even though some users in other threads prefer not to use it. It's always super-smooth. The unit rises to three feet and stabilizes perfectly still, then I take it to about 30 feet to make sure it's still stable. And then up we go "to where no man has gone before!"

I do occasional compass calibrations, and even fewer cold IMU calibrations at reasonable but not obsessive intervals. And everything is usually glass smooth!

Hi SouthernPhantom
what your talking about doesn't really apply to the P1 as the P3 is an entirely different ("kettle of fish") but I have read on the P3 forum about guys having problem taking off on auto and flipping upside down, have a look and check it out

 

[teccer]

About the weight I will let you know ASAP.
To have the wires outside(at least the balance cable) is a must if you want to add a low voltage alarm buzzer. I bought a settable threshold alarm buzzer from Banggood and I found it very usefull. I set the alarm at 3.7V/cell and I can hear the buzzer even at a distance of 130/150 mt and more (in a quiet environment): this gives me an early warning with 2.5 / 3 minutes of remaining fly time, so I have all the time to quietly go back home. I tried with the alarm setting at 3.6V/cell, but it is really too close to the first level setting in Naza, so the warning is not an "early warning". The voltage alarm buzzer is also useful to test the battery voltage before starting or at the end of the loading process, so I find it very useful. The size and weight is very small and can be easily mounted of the front of the battery cover using Velcro.
Do you mind to give me the low voltage settings (loaded) you have done in the Naza assistant?

======================================================================
I've cut 2 groves in the side of the battery cover so the wires are outside for connection, had a couple of flights today and found it was a lot easier to put battery in shut cover and connect, I did know about this tip but didn't want to cut the phantom cover about but now I'm glad I did.
as for the low battery buzzer I've got 6 of them, used them in my other quads and tricopters (KK2 control boards) again the only reason I haven't used it on the phantom is because when they start buzzing/loud beeping it sounds for dam miles, well almost!! and brings attention to the quad when I'd rather not too many folk knows it's there.
the weight of the basic buzzer is 15 grms but I've taken the cover off one of then now it's only 9 grams, quite a bit of weight saving, see photo.

as for my low voltage setting in the assistant I haven't touched them, still set at default.

on my other tris/quads I used to have the buzzers set at 3.6v but as you say tha'ts close to the phantom setup

just ignore the state of the buzzers as they have been through a lot in the past, I might try the stripped down one and see how I get on with it.
got one still in it's factory wrapping, had to get it as at the time I got 2 for the price of 1

 

[gianni_BT]

Not quite sure if this applies to the problems being mentioned here. But I've never had a bad auto takeoff with my P3, even though some users in other threads prefer not to use it. It's always super-smooth. The unit rises to three feet and stabilizes perfectly still, then I take it to about 30 feet to make sure it's still stable. And then up we go "to where no man has gone before!"

I do occasional compass calibrations, and even fewer cold IMU calibrations at reasonable but not obsessive intervals. And everything is usually glass smooth!

Thanks for your reply.
Phantom 1 does not have an auto take-off function: we are discussing of an issue during manual take off, that has been solved in different ways, probably due to the different configurations of the quads.
I make the same as you: IMU calibration only if required by quad or software and compass calibration occasionally, when I move to different flight fields far away each other or if I start to see a significant toilet bowl effect when I decrease the altitude.
What about low voltage settings in Naza Assistant software? Does P3 has the same 2 low voltage level settings as P1? What values did you set?

 

[TMB54]

When taking off with the phantom I use full throttle then I reduce it to a hover for a few seconds to make sure everything is ok, then I do what ever I want to do. I have watched a video that says do not take of trying to increase the throttle gently but give it the full throttle then decrease it to a hover, and then fly around.

 

[TMB54]

IMU and compass calibration has nothing to do will take off. It's the center of gravity that make the quadcopter take off or lean when it takes off. It's in the Naza M V2 software and shows you the CG point how to's. If you have a gimbal mounted that will change the CG point drastically so you will have to use the joystick controls to compensate for it. Even just using the mount that is supplied for the GoPro camera's can make the CG different and the take off is affected. Again just use the joystick to compensate for it. It's not a bad idea to do an IMU advanced calibration about every 15 flights or so and do a compass calibration every time you fly. If you take off from a concrete pad the re-bar (steel bars) that is in the concrete will affect the GPS and satellite connection, it will finally get enough satellites to take off and then you will get more of them as you fly away from the concrete pad. I know because I had done it and it took over 5 minutes for the GPS to lock on and be able to fly. Have a nice day and HAPPY FLYING to all

 

[gianni_BT]

you must be well pleased with your results, I see you got the 2700mAh lipos, I've got 2 but my last lipo is a 3000 mAh and get another 2 minutes with that so according to that you might even get 15 minute flights with a 3000.
as I've got a gimbal and fpv gear adding to my weight that must account for why I only get 10 minutes, AUW is about 1235 grms, what is your weight including lipo?.
up till now I have been shoving the lipo in wires first but I see your point, it's not doing the wires a lot of good so today I'll be doing the same as you with the wire connections outside, I know it will make things a lot easier because sometimes it takes time to get the lipo in wire first, forget what it looks like it works
thanks for your reply
ray

These are the weights of the quad with the following configuration:
quad, 8" stock propellers,propeller's guard, camera SJ4000 mounted on the stock fixed support, low voltage buzzer alarm (9 gr.):
1) with 2700 mah battery: 1003 gr.
2)with stock 2200 mah battery: 979 gr.

 

[teccer]

Hi Gianni thanks for your info on the weight of your phantom, I suppose if I never had my gimbal mine would be around your weight as it is mine is "officially" over weight but I'm having no problem with it flying in any way,( p2 props fitted) I suppose it might be a bit slower but as I've increased the weight over a period of time I haven't noticed it.
since you've suggested about having the lipo wires coming out the front and I then done the same, it's made the setting up process a lot quicker and another thing it's a lot stressful on the lipo wires.
before having to shove the 3000mAh lipo in wire first by the time I'd fiddled doing that and getting the door closed often I'd miss the CL & HL flashes and still sit there waiting for them like an idiot.

cheers
ray