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is VLOS defined as only naked eye sight?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by lesd, May 14, 2015.

  1. lesd

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    Just wondering if VLOS includes usage of binoculars , etc ?
    For example, if you have a spotter with some stabilized binoculars looking at your craft all the time ?
     
  2. msinger

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    VLOS is naked eye sight. Contacts or glasses are acceptable though.
     
  3. IflyinWY

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    The short answer is "NO".
     
  4. IrishSights

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    I was told in an email enquiry response from the UK CAA that lights would be regarded as an 'aid' to VLOS. So adding extra bright lights in order to see the aircraft does does not qualify as unaided VLOS even though you could see it further away. Don't really get fuuly the logic of that but that's the CAA for ya.

    I suppose if extra lights were bright enough and you could see it at a mile, they regard you not having enough spatial awareness to avoid colision with other aircraft or structures. Any way, I'm happy with 500m.
     
  5. Hughie

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    Whilst given the right background it is easy to see a quad at 500m and 100m up, I still have that problem where I look down at the monitor for a moment to redirect the flight path or to frame a shot, then look up, and its gone.

    So on that basis if they are imposing a VLOS rule, 500m/400' (UK) is actually quite generous, because I find it difficult to do reliably. Certainly without FPV I would be screwed. Every flight return would be courtesy of RTH.
     
    #5 Hughie, May 15, 2015
    Last edited: May 15, 2015
  6. IrishSights

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    This might sound funny to see, but during GS missions when I'm trying to keep an eye on the aircraft I point my finger at it, then look down, check the telemetry quickly, when I look back up at where my finger is pointing the aircraft is easily (mostly lol) spotted again. I usually explain what I am doing to watchers in case they thing I'm madder than I actually am.
     
  7. BobUnplugged

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    "Line of sight" does not mean "within sight". We have all looked down at our controls, then looked back up and been unable to immediately spot our Phantom. Line of sight means that there should be un unobstructed line between your Phantom and your eyes. That does not necessarily mean that you can see your Phantom. VLOS suggests that you can't "legally" fly around backs of buildings or over hills or fly in a way or place that puts objects between you and your Phantom.
     
  8. Hughie

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    In the UK at least, my understanding of the law, is that you should be able to see the aircraft at all times.

    "The person in charge of a small unmanned aircraft must maintain direct, unaided visual contact with the aircraft sufficient to monitor its flight path in relation to other aircraft, persons, vehicles, vessels and structures for the purpose of avoiding collisions."


    I guess the nuance is in the "sufficient" bit
     
  9. locoworks

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    paint it dayglo green or orange for a bit of extra legallity, white isn't exactly stand out against the sky.
     
  10. Hughie

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    It is yellow and black, and in fact the black helps a lot more than the yellow.
     
  11. GoodnNuff

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    For our hobby, Line of Sight means within VISUAL sight at all times, which is why the FAA refers to this as VLOS (Visual Line of Sight).
    Flying out of sight without obstructions in between you and your drone is BLOS = Beyond Line of Sight.
     
  12. Clipper707

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    Yes, this sounds funny to see, but it's a great idea. Thanks for sharing. I'm eager to try it.
     
  13. SilentAV8R

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    And there is more to it than merely being able to "see" your aircraft. You need to be able to see it clearly enough to be able to know its orientation and to be able to guide it to avoid potential conflicts with manned aircraft. Past about 600 feet or so laterally I can still technically "see" my Phantom but my ability to do so well enough to maneuver without looking at the app screen is greatly reduced.
     
  14. IflyinWY

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    Well crap. This didn't go as I would have expected it to.

    OP (Original Poster) lesd, where the heck are you, so we can keep this thread under control. There's this side of the pond and that side. No disrespect intended, but ****. We see through these eyes and you folks see through those... (pun totally intended).

    I sure hope the OP can help us focus. My vision is quite blurry... just another Pun. :p
     
  15. Hughie

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    I didn't see that coming :)
     
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  16. BobUnplugged

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    DIRECT, UNAIDED VISUAL CONTACT is different from visual line of sight.
     
  17. Hughie

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    You don't have to shout. Really :rolleyes:

    But actually, it depends where you are getting your definition and your context from.

    The dumbed-down easy to understand version of the law I quoted, as published by the CAA uses the words "within your sight at all times" which I would argue is the same as visual line of sight. Also if you disassemble the adjectives in 'direct unaided visual contact' there is nothing in there which suggests it has to be continuous. So on balance I disagree with your assertion.
     
  18. BobUnplugged

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    If your ears were hurt by my EMPHASIS on the term I quoted, you may have your ears to close to your monitor.

    I think we may be comparing two different standards. CAA says "within your sight at all times" (or WITHIN YOUR SIGHT AT ALL TIMES for the hearing impaired...) and FAA says VLOS. I think they are two different things.
     
  19. Mal_PV2_Ireland

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    I think they are pretty much the exact same thing, CAA & FAA.
     
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  20. Mal_PV2_Ireland

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    These rules were brought in for model aircraft before drones with fpv equipment. Ask any member of a model plane club from either jurisdiction what they think the definition is and they'll tell ya they are both the same.