H3-3D "jello" issues

[Jaybee]

Out of interest (not sure if you've looked under the hood yet) but has your new P2+ got an 'interference board installed?

What makes you imagine that this add-on (to prevent electronic interference with the FPV signal) has any effect on vibration-induced jello/rolling shutter artifacts?

I didn't imagine. Just trying to discern if that thing came out before / after the initial combo release.

This is the worst DJI product release yet. Total **** up.

 

[thongbong]

I've read countless places and many forums about GoPro Jello being caused by a rolling shutter and a ND filter should help. Most of these also claim jello isn't caused by vibration or is only a small factor.

My opinion, vibration is the main culprit that causes Jello. Gimbal motor vibration, unbalanced props, etc.

Reason why is that, I have never heard of anyone complaining about jello outside multirotors. I have yet to see one high speed sports clip--gopro mounted to car, snowboard, bike-- that suffers from jello.

2nd reason, I have a gimbal that hums and vibrates much like the new h3-3d gimbals. The latter vibrates alot more, but when it does, it creates the jello we all know. An affect I can produce over and over again by moving the pitch to a certain angle. It goes into a high frequency vibration and produces jello.

thoughts?

 

[landonkk]

I received my Phantom 2 and H3-3D on the weekend and all is working great. Other than the fact the installation video on their website shows putting 2 plastic safety pin to hold the gimbal together but don't mention that doing this will result in the gimbal hitting the pin as it pans around.

But I'm getting great stable video with stock white rubbers and no firmware update. Straight out of the box and into the air. Only video issue I've had so far is when the sun goes through the props and hits the lens. Creates a strobing look. Going to try make a little lens hood to stop this.

Updating to the latest firmware should solve the issue of it hitting the pin, or a lot of people are using zip ties in place of the pins so it doesn't obstruct gimbal movement.

 

[landonkk]

I've read countless places and many forums about GoPro Jello being caused by a rolling shutter and a ND filter should help. Most of these also claim jello isn't caused by vibration or is only a small factor.

My opinion, vibration is the main culprit that causes Jello. Gimbal motor vibration, unbalanced props, etc.

Reason why is that, I have never heard of anyone complaining about jello outside multirotors. I have yet to see one high speed sports clip--gopro mounted to car, snowboard, bike-- that suffers from jello.

2nd reason, I have a gimbal that hums and vibrates much like the new h3-3d gimbals. The latter vibrates alot more, but when it does, it creates the jello we all know. An affect I can produce over and over again by moving the pitch to a certain angle. It goes into a high frequency vibration and produces jello.

thoughts?

I certainly agree with you. The reason I do is because I flew my H3-2D with the exact same camera, exact same camera settings and exact same style of flying and never had jello. That leads me to believe that vibrations are getting through to the camera on this gimbal that were not on the previous one. I have no doubt that an ND filter will help, but as is with most issues with these things it is simply slapping tape on a problem and not resolving its root cause. I have a ND filter arriving today so we will see how much it helps.

 

[landonkk]

I installed a Polar Pro ND Lens and it seems to have really helped the jello situation. Another positive is it gets rid of the strobing that is caused by the blades in sunlight. The downside is it is somewhat difficult to counter balance the weight of the lens and I hate to use Sugru (a silly putty mold type product) and a nickel and two quarters!

 

[thongbong]

I installed a Polar Pro ND Lens and it seems to have really helped the jello situation. Another positive is it gets rid of the strobing that is caused by the blades in sunlight. The downside is it is somewhat difficult to counter balance the weight of the lens and I hate to use Sugru (a silly putty mold type product) and a nickel and two quarters!

That's great to hear! I guess a bandaid is better than nothing. What were the lighting conditions you were flying in?

 

[landonkk]

I installed a Polar Pro ND Lens and it seems to have really helped the jello situation. Another positive is it gets rid of the strobing that is caused by the blades in sunlight. The downside is it is somewhat difficult to counter balance the weight of the lens and I hate to use Sugru (a silly putty mold type product) and a nickel and two quarters!

That's great to hear! I guess a bandaid is better than nothing. What were the lighting conditions you were flying in?

It was later in the afternoon (around 5 o'clock here on the west coast), but it was sunny and clear. I don't think it can get much brighter other than high noon.

Ianwood, somebody over at RCGroups posted a picture of your gimbal balancing mechanism. I was wondering if you could point to the thread where you discuss how you set that up? Thanks in advance.

 

[landonkk]

I installed a Polar Pro ND Lens and it seems to have really helped the jello situation. Another positive is it gets rid of the strobing that is caused by the blades in sunlight. The downside is it is somewhat difficult to counter balance the weight of the lens and I hate to use Sugru (a silly putty mold type product) and a nickel and two quarters!

That's great to hear! I guess a bandaid is better than nothing. What were the lighting conditions you were flying in?

Now I am running into issues with my gimbal resetting mid-flight because I can't get the counter-balance correct. It seems balanced with the gimbal powered down, but during flight anytime I pitch the camera down at all it does the reset.

I advise all who are thinking about it to hold off on ordering the new H3-3D. Apparently some dealers are now saying the included "anti-interference" board is to help this jello issue and is a problem with the first batch sent out. I installed the board and it helped nothing. Looks like I involuntarily signed up to be a beta tester for DJI.

 

[thongbong]

Now I am running into issues with my gimbal resetting mid-flight because I can't get the counter-balance correct. It seems balanced with the gimbal powered down, but during flight anytime I pitch the camera down at all it does the reset.

I advise all who are thinking about it to hold off on ordering the new H3-3D. Apparently some dealers are now saying the included "anti-interference" board is to help this jello issue and is a problem with the first batch sent out. I installed the board and it helped nothing. Looks like I involuntarily signed up to be a beta tester for DJI.

This is terrible. If the new version of the H3-3D comes out jello free, they will hear from me. The old H3-2D I had was smooth and jello free too. It was the best gimbal I owned. Next time, I'll wait before becoming a beta tester too.

 

[EMCSQUAR]

There's been 2 firmware updates since release - have you done the latest? -> http://www.dji.com/product/zenmuse-z15-gh3/download

 

[Jaybee]

There's been 2 firmware updates since release - have you done the latest? -> http://www.dji.com/product/zenmuse-z15-gh3/download

That's the wrong product, the correct page (one update) http://www.dji.com/product/zenmuse-h3-3d/download

 

[Jaybee]

Some useful info on jello:

"Jello on GoPro Cameras:
50% of jello is vibration and dampening related, and the 50% remaining are wrong PID settings, mostly D setting and also the power to the motor. A simple test is, once gimbal is initialized, put a finger on the camera and very slightly press pitch. If you can feel a small “buzzing” or vibration appearing, the D gain or the power might be too high. Remember that it is not necessary (also not recommended) to have ultra-fast “back to neutral” when forcing the gimbal to move. We will never have similar reactions in flight and better have a smooth and linear back to neutral with the small bounce as explained regarding gain and reaction time, than ultra-fast and sharp return to neutral that will cause you moreproblems in flights that what you expected."

Source: http://aerialpixels.com/support/alexmos ... ing-guide/

Interesting as some people are adamant that jello is not caused by anything other than dampers etc.

Perhaps that 'interference board' goes some way to regulate power too?

 

[thongbong]

Some useful info on jello:

"Jello on GoPro Cameras:
50% of jello is vibration and dampening related, and the 50% remaining are wrong PID settings, mostly D setting and also the power to the motor. A simple test is, once gimbal is initialized, put a finger on the camera and very slightly press pitch. If you can feel a small “buzzing” or vibration appearing, the D gain or the power might be too high. Remember that it is not necessary (also not recommended) to have ultra-fast “back to neutral” when forcing the gimbal to move. We will never have similar reactions in flight and better have a smooth and linear back to neutral with the small bounce as explained regarding gain and reaction time, than ultra-fast and sharp return to neutral that will cause you moreproblems in flights that what you expected."

Source: http://aerialpixels.com/support/alexmos ... ing-guide/

Interesting as some people are adamant that jello is not caused by anything other than dampers etc.

Perhaps that 'interference board' goes some way to regulate power too?

That's what I was hoping. I had an old gimbal that had bad vibrations. I ended up placing a downstep voltage regulator inline with the gimbal and adjusted the power until many of the vibrations were calmed. I think I'll try that with the H3-3D sometime this weekend.

 

[FASTFJR]

I have very little if any "Jello" and I've pushed it pretty hard. White balls with zip tie. I just got a small sheet of 50 Duro sorbothane and just from sh*ts and giggles I'm going to try that. One thing I did do which I don't think anyone has done is to add small rubber washer (4) between the metal mount and the body. This also helps keep the gimbal motor off the battery, not that I ever had an issue with it touching

Thanks for the tip, Fastfjr. What are your gains set at? I might try the rubber washer idea... seems like it couldn't hurt. I also just ordered a ND Filter fromPolar Pro on amazon for $30. Supposed to help slow down the shutter speed of the GoPro helping the rolling shutter issue.

I'll report back with my findings.

My gain settings are stock. I spent about 4 hours last week playing around and finally gave up.

 

[ianwood]

Interesting:

it’s an EMI noise problem. Fit a ferrite ring around the motors outputs on the board and the I2C cable still right out of the board. Also, use a LC filter (Power Noise Filter) if you feed the gimbal right out from the main lipos.
I2C errors are worse when the sensor cable is running along aluminum parts or close to the motors / motor wires. Make sure to route it not too close to wires that emit RF noise.

That's what the interference board is doing except it is an opto-isolator (guess) instead of a ferrite filter. However, if you put the board in the P2, you might negate it's benefit.

 

[landonkk]

Interesting:

it’s an EMI noise problem. Fit a ferrite ring around the motors outputs on the board and the I2C cable still right out of the board. Also, use a LC filter (Power Noise Filter) if you feed the gimbal right out from the main lipos.
I2C errors are worse when the sensor cable is running along aluminum parts or close to the motors / motor wires. Make sure to route it not too close to wires that emit RF noise.

That's what the interference board is doing except it is an opto-isolator (guess) instead of a ferrite filter. However, if you put the board in the P2, you might negate it's benefit.

I have no idea what that means... However, my anti-interference board is installed inside, taped to the main board as was suggested in a video somebody posted. Are you suggesting that installing outside the shell might make a difference?

 

[lightingbryan]

Just want to follow this post.