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H.O.A. Letter

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by schemer, Sep 24, 2015.

  1. schemer

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    Just received a letter from my HOA that we have 30 days before they propose a "no drone zone" for my neighborhood. 30 days to state my case. I can see both sides, but this is the dumbest thing I've ever heard of. I don't think these old farts understand the capabilities of a P3P for instance. How would it possibly be enforced. What about drones taking off outside the neighborhood?Unfortunately, everyone thinks the UAV is "watching" them. True paranoia. Besides, how will I get my Amazon packages delivered?
     
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  2. N017RW

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    What State are you in?
    I've had a lot of experience dealing with HOAs and comes down to your documents.

    Usually they can get you by stating you are creating 'noxious' activities (noise, etc.) which can prevent you from flying over your own parcel.
     
  3. tcope

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    Let them know that they are not the FAA (in case they are confused). Cite the US Code that states that the Fed Govt is in charge of airspace and the Code that states the FAA is in charge of regulating airspace.

    Your HOA is free to regulate the land that they own and what happens _on_ the _land_. That is all. However, this would probably include operating the drone even from your own property.

    They can no more regulate your drone in the air then they can regulate aircraft (it's been ruled your drone is an "aircraft" when it comes to FAA regulation).

    It really is a question of how they word their regulation. That is, if they attempt to restrict airspace or where a drone can be operated from.

    Let me scan some paperwork my parents just sent me a few days ago on this very subject (HOA's wanting to ban drones, not going into details on the law) and I'll add it to this post. You may even want to share the paperwork with the HOA.
     
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  4. N017RW

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    If you don't feel like waiting you can simply Google the subject and get all kinds of articles and opinions.

    Unfortunately the only opinions that count are Judges' and those don't seem to prevalent, yet.
     
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  5. schemer

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    I'm in San Diego, CA.
     
  6. schemer

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    Thanks Tcope. That'd be great.
     
  7. N017RW

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    California has very well documented resources for HOAs. It's the Davis-Sterling Act I believe.

    Out right banning may not be possible at this time but my initial 1000 ft view seems to say the onus is on the HOA to create rules not for you to ask for permission.

    There's also a lot of HOA forums you can visit where you'll get a lot of CA specific help with what D-S provides you as rights to ownership.

    Again YOUR HOA documents are the key to the extent of the Board's 'reach' without requiring membership voting.

    Please keep us posted in this thread!
     
  8. tcope

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    Here is the scan....

    Is the HOA just determining if they should look into regulation? I'd think if they were going to vote on if they were going to make regulation that they would need first need to see the regulations that they would put into place. If they were just wondering if they should, I'd recommend showing them a flight of the Phantom. I'd then show them video from the Phantom (from something like 150'). I'd then show them an image from a camera taken from 150' away that is zoomed in. Point out that an every day phone camera can record far more then a drone and that drones are a much larger investment. Point out that the sound drone gives off means it's not going to be able to spy on people without them knowing. It's also no louder then a person using a weed wacker. Despite what the news covers, they are not this huge danger. Far more people are injured by baseballs then drones. That will never change. Not everyone owns a drone and there is no good indication that so many people will own them that they will be a bigger issue (and if that did happen, they can make a regulation at that time). Point out that drones can be used to inspect the condition of roofs instead of climbing up an old ladder and walking on a roof. Photos from a drone can be used by the HOA to show people the over-all condition of the general property.

    Bottom line... drones are not an issue that people such as HOA's really need to fear or worry about. Its the media driving that train.
     

    Attached Files:

    #8 tcope, Sep 24, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2015
    Cerone and schemer like this.
  9. schemer

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    Agreed. Thanks again.
     
  10. N017RW

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    Statistics about baseballs and weed whackers mean nothing to those condo commandos. It's a power trip and unless you want to hire a lawyer you're often screwed. It's not about what happens to strangers but what can happen to the members.

    The majority of owners don't have drones and therefore it can be a struggle unless you can get support form other members.
     
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  11. SteveMann

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    49 USC § 40103 - "Sovereignty and use of airspace":
    (a) Sovereignty and Public Right of Transit.—
    (1) The United States Government has exclusive sovereignty of airspace of the United States.

    Only the FAA can create a "no-fly" zone.
    Only the FAA can regulate flight.

    This is what we in the rational world call "Fear Mongering".

    Today (if this is an average day):
    268 people in US hospitals will die because of medical mistakes.
    162 people will be wounded by firearms in the US.
    117 Americans will die in an automobile accident.
    98 people in the US will die from the flu.
    53 people will kill themselves with a firearm.
    46 children will suffer eye injuries.
    37 will persons will die from AIDS.
    30 people will die in gun-related murders
    0 people will be seriously injured or killed by a small drone accident.

    There is absolutely no factual evidence to support the fear and ignorance around small personal drones. There have been hundreds of thousands of hours of flight of small drones, yet there is not one verifiable report of a drone crash that resulted in a serious injury as defined by the NTSB to someone not connected to the flight. Not one. (A Band-Aid is not a serious injury- See CFR 49 §830.2). There is also not one verifiable report of a collision between a small drone and a manned aircraft. Not one.

    Small UAVs do not pose any significant risk to the National Airspace System. "Dangerous" and "invasion of privacy" concerns are ridiculous, driven by paranoia borne of ignorance.
     
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  12. N017RW

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  13. N017RW

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    Same mentality as those who wait for a fatality to install a traffic light.
     
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  14. N017RW

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    Your very good a researching the past but have liitle vision for the future.
     
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  15. schemer

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    More good info. Thanks Steve.
     
  16. jahjahwarrior

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    101 good reasons not to live in an HOA. Bet your next house isn't in one. Good luck and tell them to go pound sand. What's the worst they can do put a lien on your house?


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
     
  17. Wizaerd

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    While perhaps correct, it's semantics... the HOA would not in fact be declaring a "no-fly zone", what they would be doing is preventing the use and operation of a "drone" within the limits of a subdivision. Just like they can dictate you can't have a basketball hoop over your garage, or that you must have a certain number of trees in your yard. It is perfectly within their right to do this.

    However with that said, there's the question of enforcement. They must be able to prove you took off and landed within the boundaries of said subdivision. But there really isn't much they can do if you take off from outside the subdivision, then fly over it. They cannot outlaw the flying of a drone over the property at all because they have zero jurisdicition outside the boundaries of their properties.
     
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  18. N017RW

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    In my HOA the Board of Directors cannot themselves make [new] rules regarding the use of a parcel (your lot/property) without a simple-majority of membership at a meeting called for such vote.
    That will never happen in my community!!!

    Much of what you mentioned though was established at time of incorporation. At that time there were no drones in the hands of hobbyists!
     
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  19. Steve vaughan

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    do what I did I became vice president of HOA got them to see it my way now they use me to check properties for violating ruels
     
  20. Fplvert

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    image.jpg
    Without a vote, the rules can't be changed. Enforcement would be problematic and very expensive.
     
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