Flying within 5 miles of an airport

This has been an interesting discussion thread. I'm going to add my two cents worth.

As someone who used to have a private pilots license, I have a lot of respect for the process and responsibilities associated with piloting a plane.

While our drones may be small, they are still capable of entering the national airspace and interacting with manned aircraft. The potential for fatal outcomes associated with this interaction is real and serious.

I am totally OK and in compliance with the new FAA rules for the recreational use of my drones. I believe any responsible adult should be too.

All in all, I think the FAA has done a good job of limiting the brain damage associated with this process. Its registration site works smoothly and is easy to complete. Quite frankly, I get tired of hearing old ideological arguments about government incompetence being used to avoid compliance. They aren't relevant here.

We should be constructively encouraging the FAA to move towards an automated notification system that works as well as its registration process. This really isn't as hard to do as some here might think. It may be just an extension of the existing system that is used to file flight plans. Again, for those who insist the government cannot do anything right, I would suggest that the FAA's flightplan system is an elegant and efficient retort.

Thanks for listening…


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I thought pilots licenses were for life unless surrendered or revoked?
 
Well, here is your shred...

You may only use your hand-held aircraft VHF radio in your aircraft under the terms of your aircraft license. You are required to have a separate Ground Station license to operate your radio on the ground.

I really don't see how it could be stated any more clear. You need a license. You need a license. You need a license. You need a license. If you don't have one, you do not have the legal right to transmit on the airband. Period. Full stop.

What if you are in an aircraft on the ground that does not have an electrical system or built in radio and only use a handheld radio. Can you still communicate with a tower, ground control, unicom without a ground station license?? Lots of people do it without being penalized.
 
I thought pilots licenses were for life unless surrendered or revoked?
The license is good for life, but you must maintain it. Medical Certificates have to be renewed every two years after age 40. There are several reasons why one can become a "former pilot" without having his/her license revoked or surrendered.
 
What if you are in an aircraft on the ground that does not have an electrical system or built in radio and only use a handheld radio. Can you still communicate with a tower, ground control, unicom without a ground station license?? Lots of people do it without being penalized.
That's fine. It's in conjunction with your pilots license for aircraft operation where required.


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The license is good for life, but you must maintain it. Medical Certificates have to be renewed every two years after age 40. There are several reasons why one can become a "former pilot" without having his/her license revoked or surrendered.

I do not think you are never a pilot but just maybe considered not current unless revoked or surrendered. If you want to act as a private pilot and have not flown for 12 years at the age of 55, a 3rd class medical and a flight review for the aircraft you are rated in are required. Being a private pilot and not have flown for 12 years at the age of 55, I would be able to take a flight review in a lite sport aircraft without a 3rd class medical. I am in that position, 55 years old and have not been Pilot In Command since 2004. I am awaiting my 333 exemption and am planning to get a Flight Review in a Lite Sport Aircraft without a 3rd class medical using only my state of Florida's drivers license to be able to fly commercially using my 333 exemption. From what I have read someone below the age of 40 can go 5 years between 3rd class medicals.
 
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That's fine. It's in conjunction with your pilots license for aircraft operation where required.


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So if I am using my quadcopter for commercial operation with an associated "N"number and knowing that the FAA considers my quad as an Aircraft I should be able to use a handheld aviation radio in conjunction with my current pilots license and 333 exemption, in theory.
 
I was 40 when I was licensed, and am now 61. I haven't been a PIC since the late 1990s, which is also the last time I had a FAA medical. I didn't surrender my license - I simply wasn't staying current and I have far too much respect for my life and others to fly under those circumstances. Whether my license is still valid or not isn't really the question for me; in my view, the privilege of being a private pilot should only belong to those who train, take the tests, keep their medical up-to-date and, most importantly, fly often enough to remain current.
 
So if I am using my quadcopter for commercial operation with an associated "N"number and knowing that the FAA considers my quad as an Aircraft I should be able to use a handheld aviation radio in conjunction with my current pilots license and 333 exemption, in theory.
No, I don't think so. I'm fairly certain you would A) get both yelled at and laughed at, and B) be disciplined if you did ID yourself with your N number. Depending on the airport, you don't contact the tower directly without either first talking to approach or ground, depending on if your coming or going. Smaller, tower only airports are few. Lots of controller cutbacks have made them unmanned.


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On the backside of contacting towers I wonder if any current pilots when approaching the traffic patterns or in the pattern have been warned about UAVs operating in an area.
 
After reading more on the subject just to be sure, you hand held VHF radio can only be used in conjunction with your aircraft radio license when in the air. From the FCC website: "You may only use your hand-held aircraft VHF radio in your aircraft under the terms of your aircraft license. You are required to have a separate Ground Station license to operate your radio on the ground." When you look at the group station section, only permanent type ground stations are listed. These include things like for maintenance vehicles at an airport, Unicom and Multicam type stations, etc. There is not really a ground station use case for "I'm a pilot of a quad and I wanna talk to the tower". Sorry
 
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I myself have Airline Transport Pilot with FAA Gold Seal CFII MEI certification. I fly corporate aircraft for a living and my P3P (soon to be Inspire Pro. :) ) I fly into both towered and non-towered airfields so the probability of witnessing the ridiculousness will be there I'm sure. If during my travels I hear an amateur calling up the ATCT for notification of hobby UAS operation I will laugh my *** off. Especially if you're not using proper radio phraseology. It's unnecessary and you're wasting valuable airtime. Just phone it in.


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My intentions are 99% of the time just to listen to local traffic.
Your intentions need to be 100% listen if you insist on buying something. However, it's a waste of your $$$ unless you really wanna "listen in". Do yourself and all the real pilots out there a favor though....don't transmit. You will be in violation of FCC regs and you will humiliate yourself.


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Aside from the licensing issues, think about what the tower would hear: "Hi, this is Bob and I'm flying a quadcopter at XYZ for a while." Even if you give them an N-number (assuming you have one), and even if they're able to pick it up on radar (depends on the sensitivity I guess?), it won't have any kind of transponder signal, so it won't show up as an airplane. So now they have an aircraft flying around with no way of telling where it is at all times. I suspect that may make them upset.

If you call ahead or work out an agreement as AC 91-57a defines it, I think you'll be much better off than trying to communicate directly with ATC.

You should check out Listen to Live ATC (Air Traffic Control) Communications | LiveATC.net for some ways to listen in on air traffic control, it's rather fascinating. Well, sometimes. (YouTube has lots of highlights from them too.)
 
They won't see it without a transponder, doesn't really matter how close you are. All they will do with your notification is it may make it into a notam for a while, and they will know your general area to alert any aircraft in the area that your out there. Something along the lines of "N6514R, be aware of UAS traffic potentially at your 10 o'clock and three miles at or below 400 ft AGL, negative radar contact". It will alert said aircraft of your general location and altitude, so that they can be extra attentive as they approach. However, without a transponder they will not pick it up, so they will not be able to provide specific location or altitude. Radioing the tower will not provide any additional worth while information. The best thing you can do is be as accurate as possible describing your position, preferably as a radial and distance from a prominent land mark or Navaid if you know how to read a sectional chart (or center of airport). Give accurate altitude range, time start and stop in the area In Zulu (GMT) time, and then stay within the boundaries you described earlier.


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In the US, aircraft radio licenses are essentially attached to a licensed aircraft (N number). You have to specifically apply for a ground station license (like a base operator). Your idiot little FAA drone number is attached to YOU, not the aircraft.

If you had a UAV with a N number, you could argue that you can use an aircraft band radio. But not as a hobby drone.

Somebody needs to try to getting a ground station license to see what the FCC would do. They're just about as much fun as the FAA to work with.
 
If you look at the different types of ground station licenses though, none are for pilots. They are for ground operations at an airport, or for Unicom or Multicom, etc. With the even tighter restrictions for commercial use, you are not going to be flying in controlled airspace in all likelihood. Honestly don't think your gonna get licensed via an UAS N-number. I would be shocked.


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Your intentions need to be 100% listen if you insist on buying something. However, it's a waste of your $$$ unless you really wanna "listen in". Do yourself and all the real pilots out there a favor though....don't transmit. You will be in violation of FCC regs and you will humiliate yourself.


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You are entitled to your opinion.
 
In the US, aircraft radio licenses are essentially attached to a licensed aircraft (N number). You have to specifically apply for a ground station license (like a base operator). Your idiot little FAA drone number is attached to YOU, not the aircraft.

If you had a UAV with a N number, you could argue that you can use an aircraft band radio. But not as a hobby drone.

Somebody needs to try to getting a ground station license to see what the FCC would do. They're just about as much fun as the FAA to work with.
 

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