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Fix for shaky video?

Discussion in 'Phantom 2 Vision Discussion' started by genoanv, Nov 12, 2013.

  1. genoanv

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    If I just hover my PV at a hundred feet or so, and take downwards video, it is very shaky, like there's vibration somewhere. For obvious reasons, the prop balancer no longer works, so I tried checking the props by placing them on a pin and seeing if the blades stayed level (they did). I haven't seen other video from the PV as shaky as this - any ideas for a fix?
     
  2. JustJames

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    let me know what you find. Mine has gotten increasingly shaky too. However, mine if due to some rough treatment of the props on a couple of bad landings where it tipped back and got chewed up a bit on the asphalt. Grr. Anyway I would love to now how to balance these out too. Would be real helpful.

    James
     
  3. PhantomFan

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    I've been wondering if a hole could be drilled dead center for balancing purposes? I can't tell by mere inspection if the caps are plastic or metal. I tried pushing an exceedingly sharp icepick through the prop's black cap on my work bench. It didn't pass through as I would expect if the cap was mere plastic. This makes it less likely I can drill a perfectly centered hole, even using my drill press. :cry:

    I think I'll use up my stock props, but never, ever purchase the self-tightening props again. From now on it's only props I can balance.

    PF
     
  4. JustJames

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    PF you seem pretty knowledgeable on these things. Sounds like you have been playing with them for awhile. Whats your take on carbon fiber props vs wood vs stock etc. I ask because in another post I am watching there is a debate whether or not to stick with the stock Vision props or to seek out aftermarket ones. For me at this point the only reason I would seek the aftermarket is because there currently is no stock ones on hand. I have already abused one set with my poor landing skills (although problem solved with the extension I added :) )and only have the one set left. I also here there are other benefits like better hovering, stability and less vibration.

    Your thoughts guru?

    P.S. Do you have the old Phantom and the Vision?

    thx, James
     
  5. PhantomFan

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    First...I am NO guru...just a guy with a lot of past plane and heli flying experience who has balanced and broken many a prop! :lol: I have a v.1.1.1 Phantom. It is completely stock. I have flown it with the self-tightening props supplied by DJI, and also some cheap CF props which I balanced with a regular everyday magnetic prop balancer. I took GoPro videos with each, and I can tell you the CF props not only are more stiff (duh!) but they lift way better and are more quiet. Properly balanced they completely eliminated any jello.

    I only bought one set of CF props, and now I wish I'd have bought three. I got real aggressive over the week-end and broke one by clipping a tree branch while honking the Phantom hard and fast around my yard (I have 1.2 acres). My next blunder came when I broke one trying to pry the other three off so I could put on the DJI props, my only replacements. :cry:

    So...my opinion is the stock props are absolutely great, especially for learning. I think DJI made a brilliant choice with those props, assuming (correctly) that they would have to withstand some early abuse. They are flexible and forgiving of mistakes. Once you get the hang of flying and want to lift a payload and give your motor bearings their longest possible life, CF props that you personally balance should be your hands-down choice as replacements. My $.02.

    PF
     
  6. Shedracer

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    Don't know if anyone has already mentioned this, but some guy has already worked a way to balance the Vision props, using this method. It's not my pic, so praise goes to the guy that took it.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. Jax Quad

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    My Vision has had the "shakes" from day one. I've tried two different sets of blades and there has been no difference at all. I don't think it's the blades. I think it's the fact that we are locked in GPS mode and it's working too hard to maintain its position. I'm hoping an update will come or someone can tell me how to adjust the gains easily so it is not so sensitive. If I fly in my garage with no GPS, there is still some shaking going on, but an awful lot less.
     
  8. JustJames

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    Perfect! Thx for posting. This along with what PF said helps a lot. I haven't researched yet but off the top of your head does any one know if the new Phantom 1.1.1 etc and vision have the same size motor shaft? I assume they do. If so PF which CF did you use and do they make em in 9"? Thanks for your help I truly appreciate it.

    James
     
  9. lylet

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    I've thought about using my bench grinder to take off some of the top/cap/nut... Just keep taking some off until light shines through.
     
  10. JustJames

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    Arrg. After another minor mishap I not have a lot of shaky..virbation stuff in my video. Its bad. Not too bad hovering but when I bank or rotate it is really bad. Like a a hundred waves through the picture. Sucks. I guess I'm going to have to throw on my other props when taking any meaningful video. In the mean time I'll keep these rough props on. I really need some spares and I think this week I'm going to locate some 8.5 to 9" props and instal them and the prop guards till I get better.

    James
     
  11. JustJames

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    UPDATE***

    I went over to Aerialmediapros and picked up the 8" self tightening props and put them and the prop guards on. It still flew great. I should have timed it but with the additional weight and smaller props I'm guessing I still flew 15min+ maybe 20 but I can't say with certainty. So I'm very happy about having the yards on and being able to get props readily. That said they did say that they were going to have some (the 9.5") in store in the next week...alot. So thats cool too.

    Whats not cool is that I still have a bad...BAD shaky jello in my video when I do anything but hover. The second I move in any direction I get waves through the video. It did NOT do that originally. However after two incidents where the copter touched a wall effectively stopping the blades and causing it to rapidly plummet and flip landing on its top (ouch!) I now have the bad video. I fear i may have jostled something loose and screwed up my expensive toy. F#@K. I thought (hoped) that it was just the props but not so much. I am also getting starts and stops in the video not with play back. I'm bummed to say the least. Im going to explore a bit more. The guys at AMP were kind enough to take a peak at it to see if they noticed anything outwardly but did not see much. They era;;y are good guys there. I explained to them that it flipped/crashed at a height of less than 5 feet but that it did land on concrete. Like I said there is not a scratch on it except the props. The body and camera look perfect.

    So I wonder if I

    a. broke something loose in the camera or its housing
    b. screwed up a motor..bent shaft etc.
    c. other....

    Any ideas or experience is appreciated.

    James
     
  12. PhantomFan

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    I spend 99% of my time honking the Phantom around my property at break-neck speed to get my flying reflexes fully back after a long R/C layoff. For all those times of "just flying", I use the stock props. On the rare occasion I feel the need to pop the GoPro on, fly in a docile manner and create some video, balanced carbon fiber props are a must. Not only do they completely eliminate "jello", but they are way stiffer than the stock props, and give far better lift and control.

    PF
     
  13. JustJames

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    Hey PF I did talk to the guys at AMP about CF props. Their lead pilot told me with certainty that they are not advantageous for this application. They have tried all manner of combinations on these and had come to the conclusion that the stock props performed very well and were perfectly suited the this design. They stated that the only advantages gained were on rigs where you were adding weight such as the first gen Phantom adding gimbals and FPV etc etc. Since you would be going over the designed stock weight capacity the extra lift provided by certain CF or other aftermarket props would be needed. For the Vision they felt that as it sits the stock props were all engineered and forgiving while also providing minimal vibration and thus jello. That was the gist of it all. So fort now i'm going to stick with the stock stuff. At least until there is a definite clear choice of Vision specific CF prop that will create an advantage. Something that will bolt right on that I won't have to deem out or adapt.

    James
     
  14. PhantomFan

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  15. JustJames

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    I'd have to see your before to really get the contrast but yes...that looks very smooth and steady for sure. Nice. Nice property too. I love that area of the country. Here in California we don't really get to see the changing leaves and all the colors. I miss that. Anyway nice vid thx for posting. I will no doubt try some CF props in the future. For now I have to figure out my vibration issue (post crash) whether its a motor or something else. Taking it in monday to AMP to diagnose.

    James
     
  16. TisiRaptor

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    But is this using a Phantom Vision, or a Phanton 1, because you say you're using a GoPro? Have you mounted a GoPro to your Vision? If not, then it's not a relevant video because this post is mainly talking about the merits of the Vision stock props versus CF.
     
  17. PhantomFan

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    The video I took was with a Phantom v.1.1.1, which means it has the self-tightening props as stock. The aftermarket CF props that produced the dramatic improvement (went from unusable to terrific) were balanced by me personally with a magnetic balancer. The same result could probably be obtained if I had the ability to balance the self-tightening props. My advice is not to be viewed as a slight against DJI stock props!

    No matter WHAT you are flying, whether it is a DJI product (Phantom, PV, 350, 550) or some other manufacturer's quad, if the source of the vibration is one or more unbalanced props, you WILL see the effects in a video, so I consider my video to be relevant across ALL platforms.

    Sure, you can put all the dampening devices you want on your bird...but in the final analysis you should make every effort to give them as little to do as possible. With truly well balanced props (stock or otherwise - lack of vibration is not an inherent characteristics of CF props!) your videos WILL be better - so much so you may be able to lose the bloated weight of your dampening devices.

    Start the cure at the >>source<< of the problem. If you can balance your props, DO IT. Not only will your videos contain less (or no) jello, your MOTOR BEARINGS will have a longer, happier life. Balanced props are better for your machine, and better for your video results.

    For those who need to make production quality video (for a living), individually balancing the MOTORS in addition to the props will bring an added level of benefit. If you check YouTube, you will see folks balancing their motors at home using an app on their smartphone called "Seismometer" and others. See, ex.: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeopBB_i8ng

    PF
     
  18. JustJames

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    For those who need to make production quality video (for a living), individually balancing the MOTORS in addition to the props will bring an added level of benefit. If you check YouTube, you will see folks balancing their motors at home using an app on their smartphone called "Seismometer" and others. See, ex.: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HeopBB_i8ng


    DUDE! This could help me out a ton. After a recent crash I have a bad vibration that did NOT exist before. I get it anytime I am banking, rotating etc. I wonder if this app can help me? I was wondering if I jostled something loose or upset a motor somehow. I'm excited to try this out tomorrow when I get off duty.

    Thx for the heads up PF.

    James
     
  19. ToddSmi

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    Have you seen this video yet showing a Dubro balancer being used for the Vision stock props? I'm thinking of ordering the Dubro unit and giving it a try. Looks like just need to find the right diameter of fuel line to use to make sure the prop is perfectly secure and not susceptible to movement. What do you think...does it seem to you like this could be a good solution?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... VdVa0jWowI
     
  20. Studiowise

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    ive ordered the Dubro (and fuel line) for the props and im going to look at maybe also using it to balance the motors as well

    http://youtu.be/UYqtwd4xXYo