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Commercial or not ?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Cornishblue, Oct 20, 2015.

  1. Cornishblue

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    Where would I stand with the CAA if I created a FREE promotional video for my local rowing club which are a none profit organisation. Would this be classed as commercial or not ?

    Thanks

    Aiden
     
  2. BigAl07

    BigAl07 Moderator
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    I would venture to guess it would be in the fine print. It really depends on how strict they want to be.

    If it "furthers" a business and that's the whole intent of the flight they may take exception and bring attention to it. Here is how I would handle it...

    I'd take lots of pictures and video of them and everything associated but make sure you do everything in a safe and courteous manner. Make the final product and then give it t them as a gift. You were just practicing and once you made a nice video you THEN decided to give it as a gift.

    I know nothing about CAA just know a little about FAA and above is how I would personally handle the situation. I'm not an aviation attorney at all. Just a fellow Quad Operator.
     
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  3. bbfpv

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    commercial = "I got paid"
    non-commercial = "I did it for free"
     
  4. Cornishblue

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    Is it as black and white as that ?
     
  5. Jeff48920

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    Not quite black and white. Commercial means getting any sort of consideration or reward for the product. Dinner, free tickets, promotional consideration, discounts etc are all proof of commercial intent.
     
  6. bbfpv

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    You know what I meant. paid = received something of monetary value from your services.
     
  7. Jeff48920

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    I know what you meant, just making sure the OP didn't misunderstand.
     
  8. GoodnNuff

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    Not this simple at all.

    While I am not an attorney, I occasionally play one from my armchair...
    The way I understand it, if anyone connected to the video makes money from it, it is considered a commercial endeavor. Though I may have not charged the realtor for the video, he used it to sell the house, so I am liable.
     
  9. bbfpv

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    Assuming you're still in your armchair, what happens if I lose my SD card and a commercial entity finds said card and uses it (without me ever finding out) to sell a house? ;)
     
  10. GoodnNuff

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    How did they trace the contents of a "found" SD card to you exactly?
     
  11. bbfpv

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    They didn't. There'd be no trace back to me.
     
  12. GoodnNuff

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    I'm still laughing about a realtor finding an SD card with footage of the very house he wants to sell, and using that footage...
    Then you wouldn't be prosecuted.

    Next!
     
  13. bbfpv

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    ****, you are good!
     
  14. Jeff48920

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    While this understanding is the common belief, legally it will be difficult to enforce. Because there is no legal business relationship between the pilot and the realtor it will be difficult to hold the pilot responsible. In these instances, the realtor, not the pilot may have problems, but the realtor still may prevail since he or she did not fly the drone. It is a particularly gray area.

    For instance, if I were to video a piece of property for my friend and give him the video; he tells his realtor about the video; the video appears on a listing; it would be next to impossible to prove that I violated the FAA rules regarding commercial use of drones.

    Here is an excerpt from a review of FAA rules. As you can see, the realtor, not the pilot who gives the photo away, is arguably the one in violation.


    ImageUploadedByPhantomPilots - DJI Phantom Forum1445452017.394398.jpg
     
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  15. GoodnNuff

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    Thanks Jeff, I was hoping you'd chime in here.
     
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  16. Cornishblue

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    Thanks for all the advice. Im new to this and looking to establish an aerial photography company. Until I get my CAA licence I think ill take the risk and create the short film. Either myself or the small rowing club would have to be pretty unlucky to get stopped by the CAA. If the film did get taken down, I can still use it for my promotional showreel when I do get my licence.
     
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  17. yowee

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    I'm like you. That's good advice.
    ---
    Dan Howitt
     
  18. AndySpencer

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    If you would like to be kept up to date on all of the latest rules and regulations, I would recommend visiting this site- www.suas-global.com
     
  19. Vanjo Grale

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    I wouldn't worry too much - I take pics and videos and give them to my wife for free of her listings, and one of our clients even works for the FAA on drone rules, and he hasn't said a thing.

    Technically I'm sure they could go after me or her. Practically, I'm not first on their list - they are going after easier and bigger violators.
     
  20. cocoamedia

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    I'm looking at completing my pilots licence and getting permissions soon too. I was having a similar discussion with someone who had just completed the ground school element of the licence recently and it appears not to be very black and white at all...

    I thought the law was any recompense or commercial gain, in other words if they buy you a pint in the bar after the shoot you are breaking the law, difficult to prove granted, but the law nonetheless.

    Even worse, If you shoot some footage, upload it to your website and it is seen to 'add value' to your offering (the subject of your website) whereas there is some commercial gain you can be prosecuted. So if the Gig / Rowing club charge for membership and gain more members through your footage then you could be prosecuted. Certainly if we use footage on our design agency website without CAA permissions we could be prosecuted, I guess the same goes for your showreel :(

    In the real world I think there have only been a few prosecutions in the UK and they were for reckless flying not commercial gain. In reality I would risk it, but I'm not the CAA ;)