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Another drone sighting at JFK. This makes three.

Discussion in 'News' started by Clipper707, Aug 3, 2015.

  1. Clipper707

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  2. jryser

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    Whoever it is is an inconsiderate or at least ignorant person whom I hope does NOT hurt someone.


    Sent from my PT beating heart
     
  3. snerd

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    "....... The pilots in both incidents did not take any evasive actions and both planes landed safely........."

    As has usually been the case. As many sightings as there seem to be, I just cannot believe no one thinks to pull out their iPhone and take a pic!

    "........... “Yeah, about a mile back there was a drone flying just under the southwest side of the airport here. It’s about a hundred feet below us.........”

    And everyone here tells me the human eye is terrible about judging altitudes. Look, I'm not arguing here. I loathe every bad story and operator involved that is published! Hopefully, one day, they'll find the perp and make an example of him. But I don't know how they could prosecute without proof............. a pic, a vid, something! Educate me.
     
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  4. ianwood

    ianwood Taco Wrangler
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    Here's a funny thing about the news: It's only news when it's uncommon. When it's commonplace, it is no longer news.

    Not to belittle these stories but if it was news every time a pilot came across a goose on short final, we'd be awash in wild goose stories.

    **** geese are going to ruin it for the rest of the birds!
     
  5. JKDSensei

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    I can't like this because it would seem like I was "kissing up" lmao

    But it is a good point nonetheless.

    I've been in the pilot seat many hours and I can tell you seeing a drone would be VERY difficult....at best. I'm not buying these stories. I think it's news with an agenda for the most part. But judging by the posts on Youtube, I do believe a strike is going to happen.

    God help the hobby when that happens
     
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  6. skyhighdiver

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    Makes me think that maybe there making this up to get more rules or banned cant believe they cant get a picture if they really see them
    As a skydiver we are at 15000 ft and control tells us traffic 2 miles and at you 2 oclock 1000 ft below and many times we never can find them and thats a big plane
    I find it hard to believe these pilots are seeing these, and if so are they maybe 5 miles out hovering and you want to make drama out of it . The airspace can be shared we don't have to land because a plane is in the a,ir just be aware and avoid each other
    I have helicopters buzzing all over,
    I see them make sure I'm not in there way fly on. Im not a heat seeking missile I'm not coming for you
     
  7. johan

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    Its summer. Most of the Eastern seaboard is going to be shrouded in haze down below 5000 or so most days this time of year. That haze could effectively mask the ground clutter which would normally make a drone almost impossible to spot below you and actually make it appear as a solid dot on a more or less white background thus making it easier to see. Could help explain why there have been more sightings reported lately.

    Either way, when they finally catch one of these jack wagons, I'm sure they'll make an example of them.
     
  8. hidaven

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    I want pictures of this supposed drone sight. It's a known fact that the morons at the FAA have a hard on for model aircraft and are pissed that the AMA was granted special exemption much to the stupid FAAs dislike. The intent here is to cause fear in the eyes of the public in order to carry through their actions. Meanwhile the U.S. Govt. continues to bomb at will with their drones.
     
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  9. jadebox

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    As noted, a "sighting" is not a confirmed "near miss."

    If a jet passed near a drone the size of a Phantom, the drone would come into view then pass out of view very quickly. There would be little time for the viewer to identify it. If a pilot were concerned with reports of drones (and, perhaps thinking of how his job might one day be replaced due to unmanned aircraft) and suddenly saw something pass by, he would be likely to think it was a drone. After all, our brains are wired to detect danger.

    Sometimes we think we see a snake and are startled, then we discover that it was just a stick. The observer in the aircraft doesn't have time to really see the stick, so assumes it was a snake.

    Considering how busy the flight crew is while taking off or landing, how limited the view from an aircraft is, and how quickly the aircraft move, it's not likely anyone on the plane would spot a small quadcopter even if they actually passed by one. So, three real sightings in a short period of time would be pretty amazing. Multiple people would have to be flying quadcopters all the time in the area for that to happen.

    It's not the FAA or the government creating these reports. It's the media. According to the CNN article I read the other day, the report of one of the "drone sightings" was based on a plane's communication with ATC. So, it most likely was the result of a pilot radioing the tower and saying something like "Have there been any reports of a drone around here? I think I may have seen one." Someone on the ground hears the conversation and calls a reporter. Pretty soon we have a headline at cnn.com about a "Near Miss!"

    -- Roger
     
  10. BlackHawk388

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    I've said this in another thread and will do so here as well.

    As a Crew Chief on Blackhawks for a long time, I amassed over 4,000 hours, a big assed Pelican is very difficult to see. They are brown in color and contrast much better than most R/C aircraft. Even in a Blackhawk doing 125KIA, MUCH slower than airliners, we had two impact the front windscreens of the aircraft. That was ONE Helicopter. Many others relayed incidents over those years. The pilots, who have better depth perception due to training than anyone else, either didn't see that bird at all or, saw it so close to the aircraft as to be unable to do a thing about it.

    These airline pilots saying they've seen a drone at any distance is pure BS IMO.

    One sighting I could understand. But all of these here lately tend to make me think there is an agenda afoot.
     
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  11. johan

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    I can assure you, no professional airline pilot alive today has ANY concern of his or her job ever being replaced by an unmanned aircraft.


    Unlikely yes, impossible no. Its actually very plausible that a drone could be sighted if it were there. Especially if the weather were hazy.

    Yep. And considering how much the prices have dropped, and how many people live in that area, I suspect that is exactly what's happening.
     
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  12. jcknows0

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    Where in Southwest Michigan are you? I used to know a Johan there but I thought he passed.
     
  13. johan

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    Johan is not my real name.
     
  14. Skidz

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    You guys have absolutely nothing on which to base this idea that these claims are fake.

    Pilots spot birds on a regular basis. These are typically brown or black or other colors that blend in with the ground. Many UAVs, like the Phantom, are pure white, and have freaking LEDs on them that you can see from any direction. You're being completely ignorant if you think you couldn't see one from the air.
     
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  15. BlackHawk388

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    With thousands of hours in flight, I can tell you this. White is a color not easily seen in flight. When it is seen, most people think it's a bird. The LED's are on the bottom, not on top and typically, we see them from a higher altitude, not from below. Or, on flight level. Still cannot see the lights.

    How far away can you see your Quad and its lights from the ground during daylight hours? Not very far at all.You can maintain eye contact for some distance, but the moment you look down, it can be very difficult to reacquire the drone. Traveling at hundreds of miles per hour, not even knowing where one is makes it very difficult to see in the first place. I personally think some of these pilots are just making assumptions about what they've seen.

    Not sure why you feel the need to call people ignorant about this. You have pilots and crew members placing input on this topic and still you insist that we are ignorant. Ignorance means a lack of knowledge. Not something that applies to many of us. Please try not to be belligerent about this. It's just a conversation after all.
     
    #15 BlackHawk388, Aug 6, 2015
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2015
  16. jadebox

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    Yes, we do - the lack of evidence. It's not up to us to prove they are not genuine sightings. It is up to those making the claims to prove that they are genuine. Anecdotal evidence is not sufficient.

    -- Roger
     
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  17. jadebox

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    No one said that you couldn't see one from the air.

    -- Roger
     
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  18. BlackHawk388

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    Exactly. Just that it would be extremely difficult to make one out and categorically state that it was a drone rather than a bird.
     
  19. GoodnNuff

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    We've also had pilots here in the past who say indeed, you can see a bird, a drone, etc from the cockpit.
    We are assuming all that are flying are small white Phantoms. There are other drones out there, and most of them are dark. Nor do all have lights only on the bottom. And look at the skins available on Ebay to make your white Phantom have the graphics or color of your choice. Or LED's available to make your drone more visible, or look like like a UFO.
    Look on this very forum how people have modified the looks their Phantoms with hydrodipping or paint.

    I do know for a fact that the news copters here in the Seattle area did capture the black colored drone on video (very visible) they found flying with them in their airspace when reporting a fire this spring on the news: http://www.popsci.com/watch-helicopter-pilots-track-down-drone-video

    The drone is first visible at about the 1 minute mark. I will not argue that the drone was in their way, but this film convinces me that drones are visible to the naked eye from the cockpit of a plane or copter.
     
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  20. Skidz

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    It depends which direction you see it from. If the UAV is lower, as it generally will be, it's going to have the landscape as a backdrop and white will often stand out. This, of course, depends on what's behind it.

    From the bottom, sides, and top (depending on the type of UAV) the LEDs are visible.

    Additionally, the relative motion between a ground observer and the UAV is minor in comparison to the relative motion between an aircraft and a close UAV. Higher relative motion makes objects much easier to notice.

    It's all situation dependent. The size, color, speed, and location relative to the manned aircraft are all factors in how easy it is to spot these things. At distance, they are very hard to see. I wouldn't believe a pilot report that claims to have seen a phantom from a mile away at noon. But that's not what's being reported.

    Hundreds of feet at least, which is much father than many of these sightings claim.
     
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