All these reported flyways are going to kill sales

Good point about them being banned. DJI needs to ensure that they have good quality control and address any issues that would be deemed device related. I have read about many cold solder joints and seen in pictures the big balls of solder on the circuit boards. Big balls of solder are not professional solder joints and prone to fail as many have and when a wire comes lose your phantom is toast. As the accidents with these things go up government will take note and they will only be allowed to fly a regulated clubs where model airplanes are flown, and then there will be really no use for them as the real draw is the ability to make videos and take pictures and I am sure no one is interested in doing this over and over again at flying clubs. Therefore people need to read the manuals, go through the proper procedures before each flight, understand what to do to get out of issues if they arise, but DJI also needs to improve the redundancy and safety features in the phantoms.
 
they also need to change the way they market them, i dont think they will ever be something anyone can use successfully, an rc background and investing time in learning to fly is the way forward
 
Re: All these reported flyways are going to kill sales

Quite the contrary: Most who lose a Phantom buy another one.
Perhaps this is why DJI is not addressing the issue. :D
 
The fact that I am now reading on the forums that there is no telephone support and people getting messages that they are serving other customers makes me think that DJI rushed to start up their company, rushed to get the product out the door (lack of quality control) and for some reason does not seem to care to much about the existing client base. I am notlooking for ways to knock them, in fact I really want one, but I am not reading many good stories about them, and to many bad ones. i always do a lot of research when I buy thinks and have many hobbies, and I know the people not having issues are out flying and don't really come back to the boards to tell what a great experience they are having, but I have never read about so many issues related to a product like what I am reading about this one. Would really like to hear about prolonged great experiences so I can convince myself to buy one. At the rate I am reading about bad experiences, I can't convince myself to get one yet :(
 
hancop said:
The fact that I am now reading on the forums that there is no telephone support and people getting messages that they are serving other customers makes me think that DJI rushed to start up their company, rushed to get the product out the door (lack of quality control) and for some reason does not seem to care to much about the existing client base. I am notlooking for ways to knock them, in fact I really want one, but I am not reading many good stories about them, and to many bad ones. i always do a lot of research when I buy thinks and have many hobbies, and I know the people not having issues are out flying and don't really come back to the boards to tell what a great experience they are having, but I have never read about so many issues related to a product like what I am reading about this one. Would really like to hear about prolonged great experiences so I can convince myself to buy one. At the rate I am reading about bad experiences, I can't convince myself to get one yet :(

I weighed the difference between the DJI Phantom and the Blade 350QX. DJI's customer service is non-existent compared to Blade. However, having had a product out for a full year longer has created great communities like this place, the gazillion tutorials online and tons of 3rd party products for the Phantom. In the end, this is a much more solid total product than any of the other RTF quads out there.

I'll certainly want to build my own the next time and will rely on community support much more so than the maker of any of the parts. There really isn't an Apple equivalent maker out there that takes care your every need in this hobby yet.
 
Phantasmic said:
Having read many "flyaway" accounts, seen many "flyaway" videos, and had a "real" flyaway (failing device - replaced by DJI) I think it's accurate to say that the vast majority of flyaways can be explained by user error of one kind or another vs. a failing device.

Ofcourse it's more "convenient" for people to blame their loss to others as to themselves, and there are people who simply did not understand what happened or "forgot" part of the events leading to the flyaways. I am a skeptic.

Yet, there are enough reports that can lead to no other conclusion as a failure of the flight controller. No user input whatsoever is accepted anymore, and the Phantom simply "takes off". Even in areas where the only possible interference was the chirping of birds.

There is a grey area (for me) as well, where odd behavior was corrected by switching to manual or something.

Even if, as you say, the large majority of "flyaways" should be contributed to the operators, it still needs to be addressed by the manufacturer, imho. Colin's (he flew away too) video was not convincing enough for me. People should be warned of stupidity. We have cars beeping if you leave your lights on or if you don't wear your safety belt too. RTFM is not enough as a defence.

DJI makes mistakes. Either in manufacturing or programming. The range limiting issue of firmware 4.00 makes you wonder if they do proper flight testing. The battery issue of the Vision. And in my case, a noisy motor after a few ordinary flights.

Flying machines should have fail safe systems in place. To avoid damage to property, people and your wallet.

Its good for you that DJI replaced your Phantom after your "real flyaway". That means that you have found it afterwards I guess.
 
Good. Maybe you can explain to folks who lost their Phantom how they can get a new one from DJI.
 
It's a comforting idea that escalated, well documented, true flyaways communicated with DJI will result in a replacement.

Even if you did not retrieve it.
 
Phantasmic said:
Ton4 said:
Good. Maybe you can explain to folks who lost their Phantom how they can get a new one from DJI.

I would suggest that folks who have experienced a true flyaway (as opposed to so many user-caused flyaways) contact DJI directly.

If the discussion stalls, then escalate. Document everything.

When I escalated I was dealing with DJI China initially. Once they stopped responding I escalated to DJI US (in Austin/NY at the time).

I worked through the US folks and eventually got a replacement Phantom (that could not bind with my transmitter and eventually had to be shipped back to DJI Austin to get it working with a new TX which they shipped back to me).

theres hope for us all then, can i ask how old your phantom was at the time ?
 
Man there is a lot of negativity regarding this company across many forums, especially related to their seemly complete lack of customer support and willingness to concede to quality control issues. They better straighten up their act or will most likely soon find themselves out of business. Would love to see companies that have many years of great products and customer support (like the ones making RC planes) step in and build some quads with the same features. Everyday it is just more bad publicity for DJI that I am reading about.
 
hancop, if you have flown rc before, and you do startup checks etc, fly it in the right location, and you are sensible enought to land it if it is acting weird, i would not hesitate to buy one, they are tremendous fun, and all the while you keep putting off you are missing out. In my honest opinion, and i havent seen inside any other phantom apart from my own, the phantom 2 i own has a genuinely good quality feel to it, all screws and aln bolts feel very secure, casing and legs are good quality, cabling inside to esc's etc is very neat, soldering looks very good quality. At the end of the day you have decided to buy a quad, and at this moment dji has the most advanced, stable, easy to use platform out there, im afraid its either this or a manual flight quad with something like a kk2 board. If you do get one and loose it , it will hurt like hell, but its not going to be life changing, go on dive in, im sure you wont regret it !!!
 
thanks Short, I really want to as I like what they can do, but also feel I should wait to see how DJI will address all these issues.
I have flown RC planes for 15 years and have never felt so unsure in a purchase as I do with these. Left shoulder says buy and right says wait and see, so at the moment I am on the fence ):
 
How did you contact DJI?

I've been to their support site and emailed them. The site says they will respond within 24-48 hours. I'm on a week now with no response.

Try calling their phone number. When you get through, you either get a message saying they aren't open, please leave a message (which you can't - mailbox is full) or that they are experiencing high call volumes, please try again.

When I heard the Verizon "mailbox is full" message, I got the impression that they have given out one guy's cell phone number, and it's gotten hammered to the point of not even answering it anymore.

I'd sure love to hear from them about my flyaway. I guess if I ever do buy another Phantom, I will need to videotape everything from the ground as proof it was not my fault. At this point it's just so easy for them to say "you did something wrong. Too bad."

Not a fun way to lose $800.
 
I had a fly-away the other day. Got lucky. Turned out I had accidentally left the WiFi enabled on the GoPro from showing a friend the video we had just shot via the iPhone app. My fault. Got out a little ways, and it took off sideways full speed. I IMMEDIATELY flipped my switch to Failsafe (1.1.1 Phantom 1 w/ZenMuse and upgraded board) and then after a few second turned the remote off. Phantom disappeared far away... and then came home. Full speed, right back to me, and landed perfectly smooth.

I always ensure I get my two sets of fast green flashes before ever giving any stick, and never change the orientation of the craft before departing or firing it up.

I don't think the Phantom flies away on it's own. I am, however, glad to still have the Phantom 1 with a much simpler, cheaper (although shorter life) battery setup. I don't want electronics, power switches, etc integrated with my battery. Too many points of failure that are avoided with the P1.

Just my $.02 and experience.

But EVERY time I've tested (intentional or not!) the failsafe / RTH, it has performed in near-miracle fashion.
 
shortyuk said:
hancop, if you have flown rc before, and you do startup checks etc, fly it in the right location, and you are sensible enought to land it if it is acting weird, i would not hesitate to buy one, they are tremendous fun, and all the while you keep putting off you are missing out. In my honest opinion, and i havent seen inside any other phantom apart from my own, the phantom 2 i own has a genuinely good quality feel to it, all screws and aln bolts feel very secure, casing and legs are good quality, cabling inside to esc's etc is very neat, soldering looks very good quality. At the end of the day you have decided to buy a quad, and at this moment dji has the most advanced, stable, easy to use platform out there, im afraid its either this or a manual flight quad with something like a kk2 board. If you do get one and loose it , it will hurt like hell, but its not going to be life changing, go on dive in, im sure you wont regret it !!!

Well a Blade 350QX is an alternative. Good company and solid products.

However the 350QX has plenty of its own problems too.
 
PitStop said:
People tend to vocalize their problems , not their successes. You don't see people posting each time they have a successful flight. I suspect the actual percentage of owners having flyaways is quite small.

I think you're right, PitStop. How popular do you think a thread will be if the subject line says "I had two great flights today". :)
 
I daresay there's never been a really "new" product brought to market that didn't have issues. Some are due to the technology being untested in the field, some are due to the operators being unfamiliar and, of course, some are due to bad designs (really a subset of the first category).

A big difference psychologically with fly away failures is that you're left with nothing. It's a very empty state. With most other products, regardless of how badly they fail, you still have "something", even if it's no more than a box of pieces - a tangible point from which to analyze the disaster and possibly to start over. With a box of parts you at least have a chance to figure out what went wrong and learn from it. With a fly away you're (more or less) at a complete loss. If I get another, will it happen again? That old "burn me once, burn me twice" conundrum. Think about how you've reacted to the fly aways versus the crashes you've read about. Whew, at least it didn't fly away.

I've flown RC before - fixed wing & helicopter (coax). I like to think that I'm super careful before every P2V flight and I won't have a problem, but I know there are no guarantees. I also ride motorcycles. It's an inherently risky activity. The point is to be cognizant of that fact and take precautions (gear & riding style) to minimize the risk. The same applies here (equipment & flying style), but with a lot less at risk. It snowed here this morning. Now the sun is out and it looks awesome out and I'd love to get some aerial shots ... but the wind gusting like crazy. So I'm keeping the the P2V grounded. Perhaps it's not a huge risk, but I'm not tempting fate for a few snow pictures.

Fly aways alone won't kill sales. They might slow sales by making folks more hesitant. Lack of support and concerns about the stability of DJI are probably a bigger deterrent right now.
 
Suppose that operator error cuts it in half, or even just a quart.

Still too many, way too many.

And, even the possibility of operator error is an issue and should be addressed.

In another thread today we had someone who left his s1 switch in failsafe and as soon as he started his quad, it wanted to take off and do its RTH routine.

You could say this is operator error, but you can also say that DJI didn't bother to recognize certain situations and present a proper warning.

(edit: my bad, you can't take off in failsafe mode, and the pilot was not in failsafe)

We have invented stall warnings and stick shakers in aircraft to warn pilots that something is about to go wrong. To warn intelligent and trained pilots.

Operator error, RTFM? No a horn thats sounds.

----
If God wanted man to fly, He would have given us 4 arms to make soldering more easy.
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